this post was submitted on 14 Jul 2025
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Fedigrow

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[–] Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago (17 children)

Please do share.

I am not attached to Lemmy, I joined because from my perspective commercial American social media is not viable for me, it's equivalent to supporting/enabling those who wish you harm.

[–] ptz@dubvee.org 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (16 children)

I've outlined it in other threads, so I'll just link to a few of them instead of repeating myself.

  1. https://dubvee.org/comment/4486545 (Mostly the 3rd section in that comment)
  2. https://lemmy.world/comment/18189873 (ThePicardManeuver's comment and replies)
  3. https://dubvee.org/comment/4492868
  4. https://dubvee.org/post/3788765 (Really, the whole post covers things, and most of the comments are insightful).
  5. https://dubvee.org/post/1516426 (A post I made almost a year ago to the day when I first noticed extremism becoming prevalent here).
[–] JubilantJaguar@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago (4 children)

Some very perceptive observations in those comments. To others - click thru and have a read! This is clearly a mod of unusually high quality, if they're really bowing out then we really owe it to them (and ourselves) to understand why.

[–] ptz@dubvee.org 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Heh, thanks. It's proven difficult to condense a little over two years worth of behavioral observation into succinct comments, so I've tried to just build on what others have pointed out with my own experience.

[–] JubilantJaguar@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I really empathize with your take BTW. Over the last year I have been unsubscribing from mainstream communities one by one for pretty much the exact reasons you cite: acute groupthink, dogpiling, purity testing, incitement, celebration of violence (the Luigi Mangioni cult was why I unsubscribed from "Uplifting News", for example), vulgarity, basically all the things you find in a school playground.

So I get you totally. And yet the "ban 'em high" zero-tolerance strategy only goes so far. I was myself banned for the cardinal sin of racism after making a subtle (but entirely innocuous) point which happened to challenge the prevailing groupthink in an otherwise pretty decent community. That community now has one less moderate centrist.

The best possible solution is surely hands-on moderation in line with what happens at Hacker News (where the quality of discourse is incredibly high despite, as I understand it, very infrequent recourse to bans). But that community is full of literal-minded geeks and has a full-time paid moderator, yes.

[–] ptz@dubvee.org 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

That community now has one less moderate centrist.

I know where you're coming from, but I cringe when I hear that term because of the straw man arguments that get thrown around here.

Like, if I were to post a spreadsheet here with all of my views laid out in detail, 99.9% of people, regardless of their local Overton window, would be like "Yep, he's a lefty."

But because of the purity testing / extreme positions around here that I do not agree with (mostly related to violence, revolution, and "burn it all down at all costs"), I've been called a Nazi, a sympathizer, a fascist, a bootlicker, an "enlightened centrist who only wants to do a little genocide", and worse.

Nuance here is dead. Godwin's law is dead. Most of the top-level comments for posts related to current events go straight to some Nazi reference, and where do you even go from there if you want to have any kind of discussion? Conversations are derailed before they even have a chance to get started.

[–] JubilantJaguar@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Could have written almost all of that myself, to the letter. Yep, now I remember your amusing description of the "responsible centrist" or whatever's the term of mockery. Personally I am that odd type (possibly not so rare these days) who finds the left extremely annoying while never voting for anything else.

I was also banned from another community BTW (relax, there are only 2!) for objecting to the egregious community rule "No Zionism", which IMO was very close to literal racism given that none of the other rules concerned specific countries or nations. The mods there would do well to read this piece just out today, by an Israeli pacifist, and consider again the value of open debate and speech, not to mention empathy (something they are always so keen to ask of others). Absolutely heart-rending.

PS: I'll add a quote from the cited article because it's so uncannily relevant to this whole thread:

So I ask myself: Where should I go, as an Israeli pacifist?

My own relatives question whether I belong in Israel, because I criticize the troops in Gaza for the killing and starvation of Palestinians. Abroad, a theater colleague once told me to “go back to where you came from”—that I don’t belong in the land where I was born but in the lands where my ancestors faced pogroms and the Holocaust. Nuance has no currency in a world addicted to absolutes.

Of course, there are far greater tragedies than mine. Palestinians are being killed in Gaza, and Israeli hostages are still in captivity. I carry the weight of those horrors daily. I’m not comparing my suffering with theirs. But I do believe that if we want a different future, we need space to speak from wherever we are—even from the uncomfortable middle.

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