this post was submitted on 07 Jul 2026
564 points (99.3% liked)

Socialism

6872 readers
32 users here now

Rules TBD.

founded 7 years ago
MODERATORS
 
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

It seems like you are stuck on the inequality aspect, and describe Chinese workers as “dirt poor.” This is actually not entirely true Just this year the CPC announced that extreme poverty has been eliminated in China. In the last 50 years, they have uplifted 800 million people it of poverty, and 100 million of those have happened in the last 8 years. This kind of exponential progress happened precisely because China has harnessed t he power of capitalism to increase development. On top of that, China’s purchasing power parity is now significantly higher than anywhere else, meaning their money buys more stuff (or inversely, their commodities are cheaper).

The material reality is that everyone in China has substantially benefited from their system, EVEN IF it has also given rise to billionaires.

So yes, billionaires are bad, but China’s billionaires are yoked to the cart that is carrying everyone to the promised land.

[–] Saapas@piefed.zip 0 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I said some are dirt poor. Not in general.

The material reality is that everyone in China has substantially benefited from their system, EVEN IF it has also given rise to billionaires.

Does the system require to allow people to amass billions as opposed to "only" allowing people to amass hundreds of millions? It's for me to hard to see the extra benefit over a certain (ridiculously high) amount

[–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I think maybe you are also misunderstanding what billionaires do with their billions. They don’t just have stacks of cash hoarded in a vault somewhere, it is all invested. This is why China allows them, because capitalism is very good at directly surplus value back into economic growth.

If everyone had the same amount of wealth, then you’d have to convince everyone to agree on where to spend it and how to grow the economy. Which would be fine if everyone’s material needs are already met and you don’t have to worry about capitalist superpowers invading. But that’s not where China is at. They are closer to it now than they were 30 years ago, and who knows, maybe in another 30 years they will be at the point where they decide that billionaires are no longer necessary.

[–] Saapas@piefed.zip 0 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I am pretty sceptical of the claims about billionaires being a necessary thing for the economy. Chinese or otherwise. Billionaires love to claim they are necessary and good and how it trickles down. I don't buy it.

[–] FlyingCircus@lemmy.world 2 points 1 week ago

You’re right, not every economy requires capitalists. However, if a country wants to rapidly develop its productive capacity, capitalism is the best tool for that, and if you’re going to use capitalism, then you’re going to have capitalists.

I and others have already explained that China thinks it is necessary to use capitalism for two reason, 1) to lift their people out of extreme poverty and create a good quality of life for their people, and 2) to ensure that more highly developed capitalist nations can’t invade and overthrow the revolution. The first part of number one has been achieved, and the second part will likely be achieved in the next 10-15 years. Number two is more nebulous, and I have no guesses on when the Chinese will feel their economy is secure against foreign meddling (probably soonish though, given the rapid decline of western societies).

Maybe a better tactic would be to ask you why you don’t believe that capitalists are a necessary side product of capitalism? Or why you don’t believe that China should be harnessing capitalism? Do you have an answer besides “billionaires are bad?”