this post was submitted on 02 Feb 2024
29 points (96.8% liked)
CanadaPolitics
1895 readers
3 users here now
Placeholder for any r/CanadaPolitics refugees
Rules:
All of Lemmy.ca's rules apply
- No bigotry - including racism, sexism, ableism, homophobia, transphobia, or xenophobia.
- Be respectful. Everyone should feel welcome here.
- No porn.
- No Ads / Spamming.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
The 2015 federal election was the first in which I was eligible to vote. I considered voting Liberal because of the party's promises that 2015 would be the last federal election under FPTP. I ended up voting NDP. This lie has assured that I will never consider voting for the LPC.
Particularly frustrating are the comments Trudeau made to Le Devoir about the decision to not go through with electoral reform. Here's a translation of the relevant quote:
You decide which lie crosses the line, but broken promises are part and parcel of the political system. It's always about compromises and which compromises are critical for you. Personally very much not a fan of dropping electoral reform. That said we got a half-decent government that did a lot of useful changes over the years since 2015. It also oversaw a tumultuous pandemic fairly well all things considered. I shudder at the thought of going through the height of the pandemic with Scheer, O'Toole or pipsqueak.
Shhh don't bring logic into this.
It wasn't a lie, they did try.
The problem was, the Liberals favoured ranked ballot but would consider STV, the NDP wouldn't support anything other than MMP, the CPC wouldn't support any change, and the Bloc just wanted to play spoiler. The Liberals were in a minority on the committee. The only system they could get agreement on was MMP, which is what the committee recommended.
MMP is good for proportionality, but it can have issues with party lists, members not tied to geographic areas can be difficult to remove, and responsibility for geographic areas is shared, making it easier to dodge. Whether MMP would even pass constitutional muster is an open question. The biggest drawback is explaining the system to a general public who only have known a one vote, one member, one riding system. Ranked or STV are much easier to explain and the current ridings wouldn't need to change.
Anyway, the Bloc and CPC were going to campaign hard on calling any change a Liberal power grab. Internal polling (not the dog and pony show web poll) showed that most voters didn't care about the issue, but the "Liberal Power Grab" would gain traction. With the CPC promising to roll back any changes, the whole thing looked more and more like an effort in futility.
In the end, they decided to take their lumps and move on. After all the heat they took for even trying, as far as the Liberals are concerned, the issue is dead. Basically a similar story arc as every time a provincial government has looked at it.
I'm sorry, but their attempt was in bad faith. They set up a committee that was doomed to fail. When the committee came up with some meaningful results, the Liberals ignored them and said "we can't agree on anything!"
Frankly, MMP is a great addition to a voting system, not a replacement. STV with a small number of MMP seats would be ideal, but straight STV would be a vast improvement.
This infographic is pretty straightforward.
Nope. This is strictly a partisan construct.
MMP is the most proportional, also the one most likely to run into constitutional challenges, and the one most likely to fail in a referendum due simply to how difficult it is to explain to people not interested in electoral reform, ie, almost everyone.
If the NDP had agreed to go to ranked ballot or single transferable vote as at least an interim measure, something could have happened. NDP went for broke and rolled snake eyes.
Electoral reform is dead for at least the next 10-20 years. The Liberals are feeling burnt for trying. The NDP are as far from power as ever. The CPC just won't. And the Bloc will remain spoilers.
I think you and I may have discussed this in the past but it's my opinion that the reason the liberals were in a minority in the committee is because they didn't want electoral reform. They should have just said heres a binding referendum on how the next election will be held.
They knew that if they didn't get buy-in from the other parties, the next time say the CPC government got in, they were going to go back to FPTP. Now they were very unlikely to get the CPC on board, but having the NDP and Bloc would have made it more politically difficult for the CPC to roll back changes.
The CPC and Bloc were absolutely going to run on any change being a Liberal power grab. Being a minority on the committee helped defuse that argument.
Any sort of referendum was going to fail. It was the CPC's poison pill. All of the parties were running internal polls telling them the same thing.
Well, his comment makes sense. And this comment also highlights why we're talking about it again. There's a somewhat unpopular government in power and people begin thinking about electoral reform. Perhaps now is the time for passing electoral reform. 😂
I don't think he'll regret it as PP will never bring it up either. Maybe the NDP will bring it up but that would mean they'll have to promise something as well.
Yeah, the Cons have no reason at all to move away from FPTP, it's probably the only electoral system under which they have any chances at power.
I could see the Libs bringing it up again in the future, I don't think they'd go for anything other than ranked ballots though, which would obviously benefit the centrist Liberal party.
Trudeau: third time's the charm!
LOL