this post was submitted on 15 Apr 2025
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So without capitalism, AI would not be obfuscating the sources of ideas, mischaracterizing the content of works, polluting communication channels with vapid slop, enticing emotionally-vulnerable people to self-destructive behavior, accelerating disinformation, enabling scams, profiling thought-crime, producing nonconsensual pornography…?
There’s no denying that capitalism is steering AI (and everything) in a dark direction, but AI is also just hazardous by its very nature. Moving beyond capitalism won’t automatically make humans more careful than we’ve ever been.
I think the point is that there's nothing hazardous inherent in its nature, and pointing to the problematic uses under capitalism isn't any more a description of 'its nature' than is pointing to an ass a description of a chair's nature.
AI is a tool, just like any other, and the harm caused by that tool is largely defined by how it's used and by who.
There's no doubt that LLM's and other generative models are disruptive, but suggesting that they are inherently harmful assumes that the things and systems they are disrupting aren't themselves harmful.
Most of what you're pointing to as harm caused by AI is far more attributable to the systems it exists in (including and especially capitalism) and not the models themselves. The only issue that I can see with AI inherently is its energy demand - but if we're looking at energy consumption broadly then we'd be forced to look at the energy consumption of capitalism and consumerism under capitalism, too.
I imagine the sentiment here would be wildly different if we were scrutinizing the energy demand of gaming on a modern GPU.
“We sometimes think that technology is essentially neutral. It can have good or bad effects, and it might be really important who controls it. But a tool, many people like to think, is just a tool. Guns don’t kill people, people do. But some philosophers have argued that technology can have values built into it that we may not realize.”
Sure, but Abigail wasn't really advocating against transhumanism or technology generally... The critique of that video is that technology isn't really the focus of the disagreement between transhuminism and anti-transhumanism, but rather the 'dressing' around a deeper phenomenological belief (for transhumanists it's the belief that technology will save us from the inequity and suffering created under capitalism, and for anti-transhumanists it's the belief that technology and progress will subvert the 'natural' order of things and we must reject it in favor of tradition). Both arguments distract from what is arguably the more pressing issue - namely that technology does nothing to correct the contradictions of capital and it may even work to accelerate its collapse.
I would really enjoy a discussion about how AI might shape our experience as humans - and how that might be good or bad depending - but instead we're stuck in this other conversation about how AI might save us from the toils of labor (despite centuries of technological progress having never brought us any closer to liberation) vs how it might be a Trojan horse and we need to return to a pre-AI existence.
It might be more productive for you to argue the case for why the effects or harm you're pointing to are somehow 'inherent' to AI itself and not symptoms of capitalism exacerbated by AI.
Who would care? Why would it be important?
Huh?
That can already be dealt with moderation tools. If you don't like GenAI slop, just ban the people doing it.
If people do this (big "if" here), then the cause is again in Capitalism (alienation) giving an incentive to do so.
Root cause: capitalism
Capitalism
Huh?
We were doing that since photoshop.
Just because you can spam a bunch of scary concepts, doesn't mean they stand up well
Another thing about AI slop is that it’s usually motivated by some sort of get rich quick thinking or plain old labor replacement. Both motivations disappear without capitalism.
Well, for myself, I just like generating pretty images for myself and my blogposts and to speed up my coding.
You can't dismiss the legitimate harm enabled by these things by pointing to another thing that enables harm...
I think you could make reasonable points here, but you're not engaging in discussion if you just dismiss them. These are legitimately serious issues and it's worth taking them seriously especially if you actually believe the things you say and want other people to understand your point of view. I'm not going to lie, it's gross to basically just say "well people get sexually abused anyway so it's not a concern."
Capitalism enables a lot of terrible stuff, but the world doesn't immediately become sunshine and rainbows if it's gone. There's still a lot of work to be done after the fact
Lol watch them
Simping for these auto complete bots requires reciting mantras while blocking out reality.
Ffs, are you really this fucking dense, or is this an act you’re putting on?
Maybe if you stopped simping for capitalism, you could start addressing that harm you like to whine about.
Of course, if liberals addressed the root causes of harm, then they wouldn’t have any causes to appropriate to fundraise with.
AI image generation is theft.
The pictures stolen to train it that it then uses as refrence to shit out Frankensteins of other people's art were stolen without the consent of the original artists.
It's theft, that's been proven.
It's not creative, it should be illegal.
Hey look, it's one of those pro-copyright trolls I was describing in my original comment about how the anti-AI trolls here are hypocrites for coming to an anarchist, leftist community that doesn't support or prop up the false notion of copyright and intellectual property gatekeeping coming here to argue that a thing is bad because of copyright infringement.
You can't expect people here to not think you are a troll coming to a community in dbzer0, AKA the piracy instance, and trying to argue pro-copyright talking points, that's what you're doing here when you come and whine about art theft. Copyright is a capitalist construct, you sitting here arguing for it, or putting down violations of it is laughable petty trolling at best, and at worst it's Anarcho-Capitalist, or just straight up pro-capitalist trolling.
Lern to draw lazy baby troll
It's not hard
I'm sorry you don't respect the work of real artists, but that's not an excuse to steal.
Aww it's so cute that your only attempt at a rebuttable is to assume I can't draw, because you know that I'm right, you're sitting here whining and preaching capitalist pro-copyright bullshit in an anarchist community. You're the one making yourself look bad, making yourself look like a troll, coming into an anti-copyright community whining about people not respecting ~~artists~~ copyright, it's really sad and pathetic. Grow the fuck up.
Edit: Wow you have one of the worst modlog histories I've seen yet. That really doesn't help your case, and only reinforces the idea that you're a troll.
I don’t accept the idea of copyright in the first place. The very idea of intellectual property is absurd. Once you release an idea to the world, turning around and claiming to own that idea is akin to slavery. You’re really going to sit here and tell me if you create art, you own the neurons that formed in my head to remember it? That’s barbaric and inhumane.
Once you make art and release it to the public, it’s as much mine as yours, and I’ll do with it whatever I want because it belongs to everyone. Ideas are a part of people, and people should be free. Anyone who claims to own another person is evil.
People who don't want copyright to exist have never created art people want to buy.
I agree it sucks that money is required for everything. But as long as we perpetuate this system it's better to not allow theft.
We should change copyright laws, but we do need copyright laws still.
I think you'll find a lot of artists who've been screwed over by record labels (who commandeer your copyright), as well as indie artists who release under CreativeCommons or Public Domain who would strongly disagree with you there.
It doesn't matter if people wanted to buy my photographs or not, I would never stoop so low as to charge someone for something I created. Everything I create is in the public domain, free to use not because I choose it to be, but because I cannot own it. How can you own art? Such a preposterous idea, perpetrated by weak-minded fools who debase art to be nothing more than a source of monetary gain. You disgust me by even insinuating that people would or should pay for my art.
And for the record, I'm not saying copyright should not exist. I'm saying it does not exist. You do not own the art you create any more than I own the art I create. Your art IS my art. I will not consider any other viewpoint, because such viewpoints are born from an immoral system and are therefore wrong.
Sorry you choose to make these excuses to steal from others.
I hope one day you will put in the time to learn how to do a real skill like real artists.
A “real” skill lmao. I would wager I’m a much better photographer than you will ever be, if I was to be so crass as to compare myself to someone else.
But that’s another difference between you and I, I make art for myself, and everyone else just gets to enjoy it as they want. My satisfaction however isn’t dependent upon other people seeing or appreciating my art. I don’t care what other people think about it, it’s an expression of my state of mind at that moment.
The opinion of others is of secondary concern at best.
If you were capable of creating your own art you wouldn't endorse the automated theft of others art.
Bye troll, learn to draw it's not hard you're just lazy and a shitty person
Oh no, you don't get to say "bye" to me. It's you who are unwelcome, and you've come here to our space to simp for capitalist nonsense. If you don't like what you're hearing, you can leave, bootlicker.
Bye bitch theif, learn a real skill
Make another account lol
Lol you got your account banned from the anarchy community, sayonara, bootlicking troll 🤣
Piracy is not stealing and never will be, seriously you sound exactly like those dumb anti-piracy people. If you somehow believe piracy is okay but training data isn't that's hypocritical and stupid.
I don't know why you think you're going to get any kind of support for pro-capitalist pro-copyright bullshit here.
It absolutely would be. But this is not about logic. It’s about making sure everyone knows that capitalism is re root of everything bad that has ever happened.
Even the things that happened before capitalism!
Are you like... lost? You're literally in a leftist anarchist community and you're surprised that people here, in this leftist anarchist community are against capitalism?
They aren’t lost, but they are an idiot. They have consistently horrible takes that they enjoy sharing with the world by puking on their keyboard.
Oh for sure, they're absolutely not lost, more like a troll.