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Discussion around the Framework mission of building products that last longer by making them upgradeable, customizable, and repairable. Consumer electronics can be better for you and for the environment.

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communick@hardware.watch

So easy, it's almost disappointing (alien.top)

submitted 1 year ago by Bazirker@alien.top to c/framework@hardware.watch

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Got my new FW 13, AMD, DIY version. It took all of 10 minutes to go from opening the shipping box to having a fully assembled, powered up laptop.

So I built a "whitebook' Asus Z96J back in like 2008 or so, and it wasn't that hard but it was definitely not this easy. Opening the packaging was harder than assembling the computer. This was so damn simple, I feel almost cheated. Anyone else ever had this sense?

Incredible engineering on the part of the entire framework team. If FW 16 has even half this level of simplicity yet polish, they ought to sell a billion of them.

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[–] killbot0224@alien.top 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

They won't sell a billion because the price premium is still significant, and the vast majority of people aren't even aware it exists.

Part of that premium is just being a small manufacturer... That is a premium with no actual intrinsic benefit, and even has drawbacks of its own.

Part is its unique build, which delivers benefits, but drives up costs as well.

repairability. Most folks would jsut as soon pay an extended warranty, which is much cheaper than this premium. If you're not a tinkerer, you're gonna have to pay labor for fixes on this anyway.
upgradeability. Great! Will most people care? And you're paying hundreds extra today just for the privilege of being able to pay for those parts later as well (okay I won't hassle about the RAM/storage, but the mainboard prices are tough on the better chips!)
customizable deck (keyboard/input modules)... Which may not be of any value at all to many people. I'm uncertain if I care, personally, unless a touchscreen macro pad happens. I just know I want a numpad.

Those are benefits that you have to pay a lot for up front... And may not get to cash in on for years (if ever!)

And that's not without trade-offs either.

Middling battery life
A decent but not "excellent" screen (no OLED)
A lousy webcam.
A touchpad that is a bit marmite.
"Only" 4 ports + headphones on the 13 (6 on the . And I have to give one up for a mouse dongle. For many, built in flexibility might be more important, especially if you can't predict your needs well, so you might be much more annoyed by not having the inbuilt breadth of jacks so long as you at least have a USB4/TB3+ jack. (Is carrying adapters around really more convenient than carrying a little USB dock? Best to carry one anyway if you ask me)

To me the real upside to the adaptors is damage mitigation. The adaptor takes the brunt of any lateral/vertical forces, preserving the internal USB-C jack.

All in all, that's a decent bit of trade off.

For me it's enough (I'm stalling tho. I don't love the I). But I'm enough of a tinkerer that I'm happy to replace a failing part for damage or upgrade, etc. Hinge, Screen, Storage, RAM, being the most likely culprits, plus an upgraded mainboard at some point.

[–] Bazirker@alien.top 1 points 1 year ago

I look at the cheap Chromebooks or expensive (yet still underpowered) Microsoft laptops that my kids bring home from school, and I can't help but think how much of a waste they are. From a financial standpoint, these Chromebooks don't have enough power to keep up after 2 or 3 years of use, and they also break if you look at them the wrong way. If they could be upgraded or repaired, I imagine it would ultimately save money. My oldest kid has a public school-issued Microsoft laptop, one of the smaller Surface variants, and the thing is a joke. It's so underpowered and so expensive for what it is, I can't believe anybody thought that purchasing hundreds of these for students was a good idea. I'm pretty sure it's like a $700 computer! If they dropped an extra couple hundred bucks, that would buy an entry level framework 13 with a newer processor, longer battery life, bigger screen, bigger hard drive, more memory, never mind the repairability aspect.

To be fair, I didn't say they "are going to sell a billion," I said they "ought to sell a billion." Your points are well taken.

[–] SnappGamez@alien.top 1 points 1 year ago

Personally I’m fine with the higher upfront cost if it means I can potentially pay less in the long term.