Maybe can we take a step back and ask whether we need thousands of AI defense bots at all? Or are we past that point?
this post was submitted on 01 Sep 2023
151 points (91.3% liked)
No Stupid Questions
35875 readers
1985 users here now
No such thing. Ask away!
!nostupidquestions is a community dedicated to being helpful and answering each others' questions on various topics.
The rules for posting and commenting, besides the rules defined here for lemmy.world, are as follows:
Rules (interactive)
Rule 1- All posts must be legitimate questions. All post titles must include a question.
All posts must be legitimate questions, and all post titles must include a question. Questions that are joke or trolling questions, memes, song lyrics as title, etc. are not allowed here. See Rule 6 for all exceptions.
Rule 2- Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material.
Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material. You will be warned first, banned second.
Rule 3- Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here.
Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here. Breaking this rule will not get you or your post removed, but it will put you at risk, and possibly in danger.
Rule 4- No self promotion or upvote-farming of any kind.
That's it.
Rule 5- No baiting or sealioning or promoting an agenda.
Questions which, instead of being of an innocuous nature, are specifically intended (based on reports and in the opinion of our crack moderation team) to bait users into ideological wars on charged political topics will be removed and the authors warned - or banned - depending on severity.
Rule 6- Regarding META posts and joke questions.
Provided it is about the community itself, you may post non-question posts using the [META] tag on your post title.
On fridays, you are allowed to post meme and troll questions, on the condition that it's in text format only, and conforms with our other rules. These posts MUST include the [NSQ Friday] tag in their title.
If you post a serious question on friday and are looking only for legitimate answers, then please include the [Serious] tag on your post. Irrelevant replies will then be removed by moderators.
Rule 7- You can't intentionally annoy, mock, or harass other members.
If you intentionally annoy, mock, harass, or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.
Likewise, if you are a member, sympathiser or a resemblant of a movement that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of a group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you will be banned on sight.
Rule 8- All comments should try to stay relevant to their parent content.
Rule 9- Reposts from other platforms are not allowed.
Let everyone have their own content.
Rule 10- Majority of bots aren't allowed to participate here.
Credits
Our breathtaking icon was bestowed upon us by @Cevilia!
The greatest banner of all time: by @TheOneWithTheHair!
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Realistically, who’s gonna stop them?
I believe in you, or should I say, gggrrrrrrruuuuuuuuu(pardon my wokie I only had one semester in college)
I don't like it but I think we do. China and Russia will certainly have them and they will get ten times better in a same amount of years.
I watched the Ted talk on defense drivers. Scary shit. Thing is I work with commercial cameras and have, in hand, camera that can not only identify all kinds of objects such a human's,, they can recognize individual humans and put a name to them. They can recognize if people are loitering or if someone is being followed. They can reconsider a car from a truck from a bus from a bike. This is not done in a server but thru the power of the CPU in the camera alone. The cost. 500 dollars.
Point being the power available in such a low cost item is staggering. Combined with a weapons platform and it is scary. A terrorist group could distribute hundreds into bushes and they could just sit there for a week in low power mode, waiting to recognize a simple person and spring into action. This is stuff we have right now off the shelf.
What will be part of military arsenals in ten years will eclipse this current tech significantly. Troops won't be ambushed by live human fire but by thousands of drones that care not for their survival.
Can I get a few of those cameras and have them record any people around my house that aren't me? What are they called?
Hikvision line mainly if you want the low cost ones.
They won't do a 'not me' identification. Mainly because it can only identify you or any person if they get a decent view of you. Basically the first event will be 'i see a human' and if you look at the camera then it can also do an event and say basically 'Jack black' is here. It is two different kind of events you need to turn on. But the person recognition can only fire if it recognizes you.
I thought the same thing is you in that I could have it ignore known people. But it like you looking out a window. You see someone from a distance. To recognize them you need them to come closer. Thus as a person you don't call the cops or create an event immediately but at some point you might. The cameras are not quite that smart yet but as said, ten years?
What I think is dangerous is terrorists or mass killers getting dozens or hundreds of small drones and installing explosives on them. Install these cameras and CPUs you mentioned that can recognize human faces and have them fly into someone's face and then explode.
You could kill many people and unless we start installing AA turrets all over our populated cities, there seems to be little we can do to stop it.
I had mentioned that in an earlier post. It is pretty scary. They could sit in a bush for a month using extremely low power motion detection. See any motion turn on camera to look for human recognition.
It’s the nuclear arms race part deux: AI boogaloo.
Autonomous drones made by China have been used in Papua New Guinea to bomb at least one village so I think the US is actually behind the curve in terms of the AI arms race.
This is one of those classical sci-fi apocalypse ideas, where humans make autonomous war machines they can't turn off, and the machines outlive the humans and continue the war for them.
How is it that when it comes to reckless ideas and notions Congress takes millions of years and the Pentagon takes no more than three business days to implement?
Most military networks are closed circuit by design. I’m not sure how this could be implemented without also allowing back doors to be exploited. You wouldn’t want someone to be able to turn off your defenses as they begin an attack, for example.
There are a number of ways to do it. You can transmit a one-time code to the device that you set up right beforehand. No one's going to be able to guess your 1024 character one-time password.
You can even protect the password entry program itself with port knocking. If the right ports aren't accessed in the right sequence, the enemy doesn't even get a chance to try their passwords.
Every server is on the Internet 99.999% of the time. They are constantly being tested. The right cybersecurity tools are available now.
Just make the code 00000 like the nuclear launch codes were for years.
load more comments
(3 replies)
The department of defense was hacked just a few years ago, suck a button would have to have access to an internet. Meaning anyone could get to it and shut off the drones and such
They'll just murder a bunch of people and then be turned off after having been shown to be ~~ineffective~~ too dangerous.
It's not like AI is reliable at this point. Way too many people are actively ignoring experts pointing this fact out and instead obsessing over Skynet or w/e made up sci-fi BS.
Rather than be used for war, they'll be used for threats of violence and propaganda. It's not a new problem. It's just a new version of that same problem.
Rather than be used for war, they’ll be used for threats of violence and propaganda
Surveillance is the word you're looking for. Take all those NSA pipelines and run them through an AI and BAM, you've got your "terrorists".
AI will be downfall of our technological society, but not because of killer robots and malevolent systems. It's going to make everyone completely and utterly incompetent at everything in life.
load more comments
(1 replies)
It should be noted that individuals at the forefront of AI research have a direct bias against saying AI is dangerous. It's their job, and saying anything which presents this research as dangerous could halt funding, and put them out of a job. It's also their passion, though, so it's an even bigger deal for them.
We have also seen individuals who have exited AI research calling for more regulation and ethics requirements. At the same time we are seeing AI ethics departments dismantled. These should stand out as red flags.
Autonomous drones are actively being used to bomb villages in Papua New Guinea. The idea that this kind of tech is "only going to be used for threats of violence and propaganda" is already outdated. It's being used today, and the US just plans to also adopt the tech itself.
humanity sucks
should there be an "all off" button?
NO! Movies would be so much more entertaining if the bad guy learned the error of his ways but was still unable to stop the robot slaughter.
There is also a danger that the kill switch command could be leaked to the Russians or the Chinese who would use it to shut down the USA's defenses just before a full scale invasion of a now defenseless USA.
I don't think the robots are the only military America would have. The military is kind of their thing.
Sounds like the beginnings of the plot to Horizon Dawn. Can’t have it both ways, either it’s a secure closed system with no way to stop it if it goes rogue or it has safety’s built in but then those could be exploited.
Or how about not building them at all
It is not the world we live in unfortunately. Tell that you the Russians, to China or to some terrorist group with a few hundred thousand to spare.
I agree. It always has been an arms race and probably always will be. Humans are too aggressively murdery for our own good. I mean it served us well when we actually had real wild adversaries, but now it's tearing our civilization and planet apart.
load more comments
(1 replies)
Most people in this thread need to learn the difference between AI and AGI
No. Such a thing would only be a good idea if you want the enemy to be able to turn your shit off when they please.
You're thinking of 'AI', as something intelligent that can go rogue. Current and near future that's just sci fi.
That’s what they want you to believe. All hail the robot overlords!
load more comments
(6 replies)
Sounds like the opening to the most recent Battlestar Galactica series. A kill switch can be hacked.
and an AI-powered air monitoring system for Washington D.C.
This is the most troubling to me. They're entrenching themselves. They already wrapped razor wire and concrete walls around the white house. Now they're deploying military assets on US soil.
They have been deploying military equipment for decades now on US soil, under the guise of police.
The new development here is that this system depends on far fewer humans and their consciousness.
Anti-robotics is where the money is.
Are armor penetrating EMP rounds a thing yet?
More likely we'll see a button to instantly transfer money from tax payer pockets to these companies' CEO's pockets
More likely we’ll see a button to instantly transfer money from tax payer pockets to these companies’ CEO’s pockets
Don't forget to add the option to tip that's in vogue for everything these days.
Would you like to add a tip for your robot defenders to this months subscription fee for AI Protection Max Ultra (tm)?
load more comments
(1 replies)
I'm sorry Dave. I'm afraid I can't do that.
view more: next ›