this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2024
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ID: 4 panels:

  1. A self righteous person holds their hand up and says "Violence is never the solution."

  2. Stephie replies with a smile "Oh! So you agree that we shouldn't give weapons to the police?"

  3. She adds "And that we should dismantle the army?"

  4. Stephie is now right up behind the other person, looking angry, saying "Or did you mean that violence is only a solution when it helps maintain the status quo?". The other person looks deeply uncomfortable.

Credit: Sophie Labelle

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[–] wpb@lemmy.world 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

In 1831, a group of slaves led by fellow slave Nat Turner rebelled against the white slave owners. The command issued was simple: "kill all whites". And they did. They killed about 55 white men, women, and children. Ten victims were 5 years or younger. The retaliation of the white slave owners was extensive. For example, in the immediate aftermath, 120 slaves were killed. The material conditions of the enslaved worsened significantly. Despite this violence, and the even more violent retribution, the abolitionists never condemned Nat Turner. John Browne goes so far as calling him an inspiration. Today, we honor Nat Turner as a hero. There's a park in New Jersey named after him, among other things.

History is rife with examples of violent struggle against violent oppression, and it's never pretty. The ANC (anti-apartheid movement in South Africa, party of Mandela) bombed civilians, the Hatian revolution involved the mass killing of French colonizers. Invariably, they kill civilians, and invariably, we look back on them as heroes playing a fundamental role in liberation.

Israel is an apartheid state, just like South Africa was. Gaza has been described as a concentration camp. It's one of the most densely populated regions in the world, borders completely controlled by Israel, you cannot get out. Half the inmates are children. The regular bombings since 2008 of this concentration camp (referred to as mowing the lawn) have killed thousands. The massacres at Sabra and Shatila, directed by the IDF, claiming in three days the lives of up to 3500 palestinians, were genocide. The occupation at the end of the six day war of the Golan heights, the Sinai peninsula, the Gaza strip and the West Bank resulted in the displacement of 400,000 arabs. This is ethnic displacement.

During the march of return, a peaceful protest in 2019 in Gaza, Israel had snipers deliberately target medics, the elderly, children, and the disabled. They were aiming for the knees, maiming some for life, killing others. Thousands were injured, hundreds killed, hospitals overrun. Despite this gruesome response, the protest went largely ignored around the globe, and nothing changed for Gazans.

When peaceful resistance against a violent apartheid ethnostate does nothing, what is to be done? If there is any justice in the world, we will look back on October 7th as we do on Nat Turner's slave revolt, or the Warsaw uprising. I hope that one day I can walk in Yahya Al-Sinwar park.

[–] mycelium_underground@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago

Dont forget that women did not get the right to vote until after the Suffragette bombing and arson campaign

[–] Limonene@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago

Violence is the solution to violence.

The threat of defensive violence can act as a useful deterrent to prevent violence.

Nuclear weapons are massively violent. Although they have caused harm in a number of ways (offensive use in WW2, experimental use, indirect harm from the threat of use), I believe they contributed more to peace in the world today.

Open carry in the US has successfully been used to deterr police from harassing innocent people.

[–] Peasley@lemmy.world 0 points 8 months ago (1 children)

We should disarm the police and dismantle the army though

[–] ShareMySims@sh.itjust.works 1 points 8 months ago

Well yeah, and I think Sophie would agree.

[–] cacheson@piefed.social 0 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 children)
[–] mindbleach@sh.itjust.works 1 points 8 months ago

... y'all know there's other countries, right? And that in those countries there's cops? A lot of those cops genuinely do not carry guns, because neither does anyone else.

Police in Iceland shot a guy for the first time ever in 2013.

Even in US-adjacent Canadia, the Parliament Hill shooting saw a mountie go back to his office, retrieve a gun from a locked safe, and return to the scene to kill the shooter.

We can have police who aren't eternally three seconds away from putting a bullet in someone's brain. In what universe is that less achievable than abolishing them completely?