this post was submitted on 15 Nov 2023

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[Discussion] My picks for best finished dress watches in the 12k region (preowned) (alien.top)

submitted 11 months ago by peninsulaparaguana@alien.top to c/watches@style.land

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So I have been entertaining the idea of entering the world of hand finished gold dress watches and came to the shortlist you can see above.

So pricewise the bunch starts with the Breguet classique 5157 at around 10k and with a bit of hunting I think 8-9k could be realistic. For me this one has probably the best dial and case work of the four. The movement is beautiful but I think it’s slightly below the level of the other 3. Overall underrated and a great package, but I feel this one is the least versatile and may look weird with tshirt and jeans.

The next one in terms of price is the LUC Chopard XPS twist with Fleurier seal. This one goes for about 12k preowned but with low stock. Dial is quite interesting and the movement has the Fleurier seal which is probably comparable to a Geneva seal. Really cool watch but the brand does not convince me compared to the other 3.

Then we have a ALS Saxonia thin. This one is now going for around 12-18k with some hunting but also low stock. This one needs no introduction, probably one of the best sellers of ALS.

Lastly the VC Patrimony Traditionnelle 43075, which goes for 15-20k, maybe 12k with a bit of hunting, but also has low stock. This model is discontinued and bears the famous 1120 movement beautifully decorated with both case and movement having the Geneva seal.

Out of the 4 my favorite is the VC but I think being 41mm it wont look as good as for example the Breguet which is 38mm. But I have very flat wrists so size is no issue. In terms of value relative to retail price the VC is trading at about 40% of its original retail price while the rest is at about 50-60%.

Do you have other dress watches in mind beyond this shortlist ? After doing the research on this it got me thinking that it’s incredible the level of watchmaking you can get with a budget similar to a Rolex submariner. I really like the Submariner in a vacuum but after seeing what you can get with 10k outside of the crown I don’t think it makes sense unless you have the means to have a big collection of 10k watches instead of a few.

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[–] Particular-Factor-24@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

The VC just leaps out at me. Some watches are the textbook example for their design category, for me in this style of watch, it's the VC.

[–] watchtroubles@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Chopard LUC 1860 with the calibre 1.96. Beautiful guilloche dial and small seconds complication. Geneva seal micro rotor. Can be found for around your budget. Beats out all of these easily IMO.

[–] lmmo1977@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Difficult choice, all good options. I would have to try them on my wrist and decide emotionally based on the "feeling" I got wearing each of them.

It's a luxury item, so any technicality of Geneva vs. Fleurier seal it's just you making a rationale articulation for yourself of a decision that was made on an emotional level.

[–] Sebast975@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Can't go wrong with any of those. If you want something a little different, check out Torsti Laine. The finishing on his customized Laine V38 with triple engine-turned (by hand) guilloche watches blows these 4 out of the water. Only con is that you'll have to wait 8-10 months for delivery.

[–] Dolphin008@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Out of those the Chopard, no doubt

[–] VelvetSpork@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Agreed

[–] TheRedComet@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Hmm where do you look for listings? I've checked chrono24 and ebay but I don't think I've seen the Saxonia Thin go as low as 12k.

[–] peninsulaparaguana@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

So in chrono24 there is occasionally some listings from private sellers going for 12k or from Asia as well in Hong Kong. But usually they are more like 15k minimum most of the time.

[–] L0N01779@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

When I compared them side by side, I thought the VC clearly outperformed the ALS-it’s too big though

[–] Wildcat_Dunks@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Someone here once said that the finishing on the dial of this Chopard makes it look like an anus, and I can't unsee that.

[–] jared_007@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Breguet for me. The heritage, the design, and just the incredible amount of intricate details make it THE one.

The rest are all fantastic in their own right but the Breguet just has that little bit extra.

[–] brichardson7@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

For me it’s the Lange for the classic look and Chopard if you want something a little less “textbook”

[–] Mhisg@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

These are all fantastic but for me the the Grand Seiko SBGY002 will always be my grail dress watch.

[–] Afraid_Promotion352@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Not really a fan of the sector dial look on the breguet. The chopard is the one I’m least familiar with but it’s very catchy. But for that classic dress watch look (minimalist and perfect) the VC and ALS are the cream of the crop examples IMO. Give a slight edge to the ALS, very slight

[–] barry2bear2@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Alange

[–] HarrisLam@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

yo if the Saxonia can be had for 12k I dont want it. How beat up does it have to be for the owner to go aiight.... this usually goes for like 16k and up but this one I own... man, lets see if anyone will bite at 12....

[–] vgcamara@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I've been telling myself I don't need that Saxonia thin for a while now, but it's just such a beautiful watch. I really want one!

The VC is nice but I would like a bit longer PR like the lange

LUC chopard offer a lot bang per buck in the second hand market but I was surprised to see this macro shots from horomariobro where he shows finishing quality is not that great for their watches that don't have the fleurier seal

https://www.instagram.com/p/CgDX4ujp8hC/

[–] Artorias_the_hollow@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

At this price point, there are half a dozen or more Grand Seiko models that blow all of these out of the water.

[–] mdcohen@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

in gold?

[–] Artorias_the_hollow@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Yes, like the SBGK004.

[–] clm1859@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Surprised nobody mentioned JLC yet. The master ultra thin moon is pretty damn awesome and similar. I think if you get it in gold youre looking at about 12k preowned. Steel more 9k preowned or 12k new. That one left me pretty stunned. Altho i have to admit its also the only dress watch in that price range that i went to look at in real life.

Btw also so many reverso variants that there must be one at this price point. As well as some master control options (i like the master calendar).

[–] peninsulaparaguana@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

https://preview.redd.it/c5i0pyb41d3c1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2a42820ac0f622124a38fc1dc37dcdc893b2c13a

Thanks for the discussion guys, in case you are wondering I went with the VC