this post was submitted on 28 Dec 2023
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Work Reform

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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.

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[–] astreus@lemmy.ml 62 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Shower thought: if everyone gives a % of their labour value to the government it's called taxes and is evil communism. If everyone gives a % of their labour value to an individual it's called capitalism and is glorious. How does that mental gymnastics work?

[–] ohlaph@lemmy.world 29 points 10 months ago

Propaganda is a strong and prosperous machine.

[–] squid_slime@lemmy.world -4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

We are capitalist society working in feudalistic companies

[–] astreus@lemmy.ml 31 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

No, we are workers exploited by capitalists.

Unless you are not selling your labour and instead living on the profit derived from the workers, you are not a capitalist.

It's a very simple system laid out in Das Kapital and still taught in economics today (at least in the UK):

Aristocrats - people with wealth by virtue of controlling land

Capitalists - people who have wealth by virtue of having wealth (i.e. they can invest/speculate)

Worker (or Proletariat) - people who have to sell their labour to capitalists or aristocrats to survive

Lumpenproletariat - an underclass that has fallen out of society and resort to the black or grey market to survive

[–] astreus@lemmy.ml 16 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

To follow up, let's talk about the names of the system!

Absolute Monarchy: a system where an individual has absolute control of the means of production (often, though not always, via birth).

Feudalism: a system where the a wider, though still small, group of people, control the means of production based on land ownership (often, though not always, through an aristocratic class) (fun fact: the Magna Carta changed England from an absolute monarchy to a feudal state, it did not create any kind of democracy, as the myth often goes).

Capitalism: a system where those with money (i.e. capital) control the means of production. We are here.

Socialism: used interchangeably by both Marx and Lenin with communism (Lenin specifically states the "socialist" in USSR was aspirational, not literal). However, has now come to denote the "transition" period from Capitalism to communism where the workers control the means of production via what Lenin called a "vanguard party" or worker-controlled legislature

Communism: where the means of production are no longer controlled at all with no class divide, legislature, or private property (note: personal and private property are two different things; no one wants your toothbrush) based on the principle "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs".

[–] feedum_sneedson@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

I just want to reach the dizzying heights of the proletariat.

[–] Alsephina@lemmy.ml 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Capitalists are the ruling class that own the means of production through private property and profit from workers' labour, or otherwise have the vast wealth needed to have decisive influence on production.

Workers are not capitalists.