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Gazans say Hamas forcing civilians to stay in combat zone, preventing evacuations
(www.ynetnews.com)
this post was submitted on 14 Oct 2024
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Hamas are not the ones who have closed off all of Gaza's borders.
The fact that Israel's actions are despicable doesn't mean you have to defend Hamas.
They're literally walking over Palestinian children's corpses to stay in power.
Please quote me defending Hamas.
Unless that was a lie.
Was it a lie?
A point no one contested, they're simply forcing them to stay there.
I don't think you understand the concept of closed-off borders.
They cannot leave even if Hamas told them to get the fuck out now or they'll kill them all.
Israel is the one controlling that, not Hamas.
Deleted, I misread the comment. Source saying that Israel controls whether they stay or leave?
I didn't say they would.
Please read more carefully:
I am still waiting for you to quote me defending Hamas.
Rewrote the above comment, my mistake for misinterpreting. I'm still waiting for you to quote me saying you're defending Hamas.
Dude, read who wrote that comment
I'm sorry, you're right. You didn't.
Also, seriously?
How exactly do you think borders work?
Has Israel stated they would not let refugees leave? Say Egypt unilaterally opens the Rafah crossing, Israel would stop them from leaving?
Why do they have to state it when they clearly aren't?
Because then it's unsourced opinion/speculation. Bickering between Egypt and Israel aside, if Egypt unilaterally opened their side of the Rafah crossing, Israel has said they would not let refugees leave?
Again, they don't need to say it.
They're still stationed at the border between Gaza and Egypt. They could walk away and leave it up to Egypt.
They aren't.
Because they don't want anyone to leave.
Actions speak louder than words.
You stating it doesn't make it true, that's where evidence comes in. I can state that Egypt's actions demonstrate the same, they could just walk away. And with just as much evidence as you provided.
I understand this is your personal opinion, and that there is no evidence supporting your claims of Israel's intentions to not let refugees leave, even to Egypt. ~~I won't be continuing this discussion with you.~~
It's not an opinion. It's a fact. Israeli troops are stationed at the border between Gaza (not their country) and Egypt.
They do not have to be there. Again, not their country.
A "fact" you just can't seem to source.
Sorry, are you claiming there aren't IDF troops at the border between Gaza and Egypt? Really?
I mean Israel doesn't make a secret of it.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/egypt-showing-flexibility-on-idf-staying-along-its-gaza-border-to-block-arms-smuggling/
You know what, I'll keep going :)
Quote where I said there aren't IDF troops. Because it would be a shame if you were lying about what I said. This is where evidence (not opinion) comes in.
What I said is that they should be allowed to leave and they aren't being allowed to because they can't cross a border due to an invading force controlling it.
Israel is controlling a border that is not theirs to control. That is not in dispute. Therefore there is only one nation that has control over who gets in and out of Gaza. The idea that they would control the border and give freedom of passage is silly.
Have you seen a mass refugee exodus? Do you think Gazans want to stay there and die? Are you under the impression that Hamas somehow controls virtually the entire Gazan population to the point that basically none of them have fled?
This is ludicrous. You must just be trolling at this point.
I specifically asked you to quote me saying that there are no IDF troops at the border, and you failed to, and I reject you mischaracterizing my argument. You very specifically said "Because they don’t want anyone to leave." and have yet to provide evidence. Reframing your unsourced claim as "they can't cross a border due to an invading force controlling it" is disingenuous and in bad faith, and also not substantiated as it similarly implies without evidence Israel's intentions.
Thank you for posting another comment devoid of a source for your claims. The "source" you posted previously does not support your assertion of Israel's intentions. Injection of this is a strawman, followed by your unsubstantiated opinion of what it means to you personally. You have yet to prove Israel would not let refugees leave to Egypt.
I am in no way trolling.
I have no idea what your argument even is at that point.
All I said is that they should be allowed to leave Gaza if they want to.
That isn't all you said, your comments are all here on display for everyone to read. And I'm very clear on what you are saying.
Yes they are:
And no you're not. What the fuck is your point?
Wow, that was the entire conversation? Where was I getting this idea that you were claiming Israel would not let refugees leave to Egypt?
Oh, that was exactly what you said... "Because they don’t want anyone to leave."
And yes, I am. Because I read what you said.
Israel controls the border between Gaza and Egypt.
Why are there not refugees crossing that border? If it isn't Israel, please explain who is stopping refugees from crossing the border.
I'm supposed to provide proof for my response to your claim, yet you aren't required to source your original claim of "Because they don’t want anyone to leave"? No no :)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof_(philosophy)
...
I'm not going to be engaging with you now, or in the future. This is extraordinarily bad form, and a huge waste of time.
Dude, this is basic logic. One party controls the border, therefore that party is the one that has the power to let people in and out.
People aren't being let out.