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‘If 1.5m Germans have them there must be something in it’: how balcony solar is taking off (www.theguardian.com)

submitted 4 days ago by alyaza@beehaw.org to c/news@beehaw.org

56 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Manufacturers say that installing a couple of 300-watt panels will give a saving of up to 30% on a typical household’s electricity bill. With an outlay of €400-800 and with no installation cost, the panels could pay for themselves within six years.

In Spain, where two thirds of the population live in apartments and installing panels on the roof requires the consent of a majority of the building’s residents, this DIY technology has obvious advantages.

With solar balconies, no such consent is required unless the facade is listed as of historic interest or there is a specific prohibition from the residents’ association or the local authority. Furthermore, as long as the installation does not exceed 800 watts it doesn’t require certification, which can cost from €100 to €400, depending on the area.

As with all solar power systems, balcony power only works in daylight and a battery storage system can add at least €1,000 to the installation cost.

Vernetta says the vertical surface area of cities is far greater than that of the roofs and that, in Spain, balcony panels benefit more than roof panels from the low winter sun.

Cities such as Helsinki are already experimenting with buildings with solar panel cladding.

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[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 6 points 3 days ago (3 children)

Belgium, which outlawed plug-in solar devices over fears of having unregistered systems feeding into the grid, will lift its ban.

Why the fuck is that a fear?!?

[–] invertedspear@lemm.ee 24 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Because back feeding the grid means the power company can’t shut the power down to work on a line. It requires coordinating everyone that might have something like this to unplug it. Rooftop installations add controllers to only supply when grid power is on, or to disconnect the house from the grid. Same thing when you add a generator inlet you’re supposed to also add a grid disconnect.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

You're sure these kits in Germany dont have that check in place? If I know Germans, it does.

[–] unyons@feddit.org 11 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I live in Germany, and I can assure you no such check exists. I have one of these systems (although I don't plug mine into the grid, I store power in batteries and use it)

I'm not sure how the electricians protect themselves, I can only assume that they measure for voltage on the line after disconnecting from the grid, and then search for the culprits. Generally speaking any service providers inform residents well beforehand about outages, and there might be fines if you hold back work? I haven't looked into it, perhaps someone else has more info.

[–] thzihdd@feddit.org 6 points 2 days ago

The system can only feed into your house line if there is an external 230V 50Hz power net working. The moment the net goes down there will be no power from your micro inverter to your house. It requires power to work and a stable 50 Hz similar to most bigger inverters.

If you combine a power station (battery) with the inverter, this battery might give you a 230V outlet with stable 50 Hz. But this is not the one you should plug back into your house (would require an unsafe cable).

Overall, lots of fear and wrong information in this thread about safety. There is a DIN norm for all of this and the current 800W limit exists to keep your power line from melting in the walls in the most extreme cases.

[–] sanzky@beehaw.org 9 points 3 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

it’s for the safety of people working on the grid. solar panels in general have either to be isolated from the grid or disconnect if the grid is down. they are not allowed to spill into the grid if the grid has no power.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

I dont understand. These people can just install more switches to solve this problem, right?

We were just dumb before and thought power was unidirectional. Now we have evolved into a decentralized grid. So we just need to add another switch to cut off power coming out of every room, building, etc. Right?

That seems like the obvious long-term, safest solution.

[–] ne0phyte@feddit.org 4 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

We have regulations here in Germany (EU wide even if I am not mistaken). The solar inverters used are required to shut off within I think 200ms of the 50hz grid power going down. The inverters sold here can't output anything without grid power being detected on the AC output.

Why is everyone in this thread making assumptions and spreading fear instead of actually looking up how it works?

[–] JohnEdwa@sopuli.xyz 8 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

And in addition to them backfeeding into the grid , they bypass all the fuses and GFCI protections your house might have and effectively require the use of a suicide cord. That part of a plug should never be providing power, only using it.