Games
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Video games
Generic
- !gaming@Lemmy.world: Our sister community, focused on PC and console gaming. Meme are allowed.
- !photomode@feddit.uk: For all your screenshots needs, to share your love for games graphics.
- !vgmusic@lemmy.world: A community to share your love for video games music
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None of those consoles would directly boot into desktop Linux with just a few button presses.
They actually do, they’re just locked down from factory
https://github.com/SleepTheGod/PS5_Linux_Boot/blob/main/README.md
Remember that PS2 natively supported this and modern consoles like the Switch can boot directly into desktop Linux.
I said "with a few button presses," not "after hacking it and booting from external media."
So what you’re saying because Valve supports it out of the box is the limiting factor between a console and pc
The hardware supports it; it could be a PC if you want.
You skipped over the PS2 and how it was a console and marketed with Linux support directly from Sony
Let alone Yellow Dog Linux on the PS3
https://youtu.be/lSP9b4Qcu4M
A clever enough person can get a useable general-purpose OS running on just about any hardware. The entire point is that it's user-friendly out of the box.
So user friendly Linux running on it makes it not a console? For a while PS3 was just a couple button presses to get a full Linux distro booted on it. I don’t think anyone would argue PS3 wasn’t a console.
No, it just means a console that doesn't support booting directly into a general-purpose OS isn't a PC.
Totally agree there. MacBooks don’t even really qualify there and even probably near future when newer Windows devices come locked down.
Wrong. MacBooks can dual boot Linux (windows too on the Intel MacBooks), and you can download code from wherever and run it. There’s a terminal you can run commands in. If you want, you can completely fuck it up. macOS is worlds apart from iOS, and MacBooks are more a proper computer than probably even the Steam machine we’re discussing here.
Actually the current M-series are struggling to be feature complete on Linux, so while what you say was true for the Intel Macs, that is wilting away.
You can still dual boot operating systems. The fact Asahi isn’t complete yet doesn’t matter. If ARM Windows was worth a damn you could dual boot that too.
They’re computers.
The pedantic argument was about personal computer, not just computer. I believe it was along the lines of push a few buttons, not hack the OS. Sorry I made you mad talking about MacBooks.
You don’t make me mad by being wrong. You don’t have to “hack the OS” to dual boot a MacBook.
You have to hack another OS to load it on a MacBook. Try running Linux on an M3, M4, or M5 today. Not yet possible.
Edit: Even the M1 and M2 Linux support was entirely reverse engineered. The hardware is not open, it’s not a personal computer.
That’s not hacking, that’s development. They’re not bypassing locked bootloaders. If Apple pushes for making it impossible to run another operating system that’s another downgrade for sure, but you can still run whatever code you want on them, ergo, it’s a computer. It’s got a terminal, you can write and run your own code, you can download unsigned binaries, you can delete stuff and break the OS, that’s a computer.
Try running anything on an Xbox Series S/X or PS5. Locked bootloader means you’re fucked from the start, and getting past that is hacking.
That’s like saying an unlocked Pixel phone is a PC because you could technically develop an OS for it. Unlocked bootloader doesn’t an open system make.
I think we’re using different terms for hacking. You are using the exploit definition.
Yeah, that could very well be a PC. You could take the guts out, put it in a generic box, attach a monitor and peripherals, and have a Linux PC that drastically outperforms PCs of a couple decades ago, with similar functionality. Those were PCs then, why would the definition change?
Regarding the exploit definition, yeah, that’s the good one IMO. The other one is more akin to “life hacks” or “food hacks” and I think it’s silly. Using a butter knife as a screwdriver isn’t a “tool hack.” Putting Doom on a toothbrush isn’t hacking, provided no exploits were necessary. Putting Linux on a MacBook isn’t hacking just because it lacks documentation and the Asahi devs have to figure some things out before it works.
I would be curious to hear your definition of hacking, though. To me it seems if you’re calling Linux on Mac hacking, then there’s a million other things that are hacking and the word loses its meaning.
If Apple locks the bootloader then I’ll completely agree with you. And while I do agree it appears they’re heading in that direction and it sucks, a MacBook is far more “computer” than a console, even if poorly documented and thus difficult to develop for.
Hacking at the kernel to make it work on a new device is a valid definition of hacking IMO.
Hacking [something together] - building something quickly to make it work not necessarily a robust inplementation.