People will do anything to avoid installing "linux"...
this post was submitted on 10 Nov 2023
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Steam Deck
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That's why they called it "SteamOS", not "Steam Linux"
Fact of the matter is the most successful Linux devices are the ones that you don’t need to know Linux to use. Chromebooks and steam decks are popular because they don’t need tinkered with. You can if you want, but the average person can just use it.
The Steam Deck is the first Linux machine that hasn't killed itself on me or given me hiccups during basic installations of things.
The only thing the Steam Deck hasn't "just worked" for me for is Rocksmith.
Again, the Steam Deck is the only Linux machine that I've had that just works and does not make me want to tear my hair out.
When Linux accomplishes that it will be more popular. Until then, it feels like trying to play whackamole with fixes and solutions to things that should just work in the first place.
Yeah, the fact that it just works and comes with the hardware is good.
However I think the article is suggesting a world where gamers go and install SteamOS as a regular distro. I think that's going to be a lot harder and more error prone than just installing Mint and putting Steam on it.
The thing is valve is doing a ton of extra stuff. Game mode by default, for example. Mint won’t do that, or at least not to the same extend/speed. If your primary use is gaming, there’s value in a gaming focused distro. You can still do many other things with it anyway.
Yeah as much as I love Linux, it's much more tuned for tinkerers, developers, and techies because everything is rtfm and troubleshooting yourself. After the initial setup process though, you would have gained enough knowledge to fix a lot of things if it ever is broken.
I agree to an extent regarding the last sentence, things like networking make that a whole can of worms to itself!
I'd argue it hasn't imploded on you because it's immutable. You'd have a similar rock solid experience on any of the immutable Fedora releases (Silverblue, Kinoite etc) or some of the other immutable distros
That's fair, although it could go further with how an immutable distro isn't as effective for some of the desired uses - in the case of the Steam Deck it's designed to do what it does and it does it. Other Linux installs are retroactively configured by the user, where whether it's a regular computer for grandma or a server for a homelab will net you wildly different results of what distro you choose.
While it's nice having options, it doesn't make things easier for new users when searching. Having a hundred ways to solve a problem just makes the problem more annoying to solve (inb4 rtfm)
Also, I just remembered I lied. There's one other Linux install I've never had issues with which was Tails, though to your point can be operated as immutable, though I think at the time mine was not set up to be RO
I just spent 2 hours trying and failing to get a Hello, World! in Eclipse, I'm not brave enough for Linux
Your first mistake was using Eclipse...
Which programming language do you want to use?
Check out Bazzite. Works pretty well on Desktop in my opinion.
Can confirm, been using it since....launch almost. Was on Ublu Kinoite Main38 when F38 went into beta.
Was on Ublu Kinoite Main38 when F38 went into beta.
I'm not even sure if you're taking the piss or that's a real thing
To clarify: I was using Fedora Kinoite 37 already:
When I stumbled upon Jorge's YouTube videos and his excitement for the Univeral Blue project made me just have to join/try it out.
So when the beta for Fedora 38 went live, instead of rebasing Kinoite to 38, I rebased to Universal Blue 38:
rpm-ostree rebase ostree-image-signed:docker://ghcr.io/ublue-os/kinoite-main:38
(The kinoite-main image since I have an AMD GPU)
Now I'm on Bazzite 39 Desktop:
rpm-ostree rebase ostree-image-signed:docker://ghcr.io/ublue-os/bazzite:latest
The Full Image List:
NVIDIA Images:
Honestly it's a better out of box experience than even a chromebook. Except it's Fedora. With lots of extra goodness and tweaks.
I really like what ublue is doing and I recommend anyone check it out. But I feel like most users won't understand the jargon used to describe ublue. Images, container, cloud-native are all terms that might overwhelm new users.
Them being enthusiastic about how ublue works is awesome though and people who understand the terms can easily understand what it's about. My two cents.
At this moment in time, Bazzite is just straight up a better experience than SteamOS. Fedora backend with rpm-ostree is way better than what Valve has going on. And for Steam Deck, GNOME just makes more sense for touch interfaces.
Yeah, I was puzzled why Valve chose KDE to be the default desktop for a touchscreen device. Ultimately though I figured they just wanted a Linux desktop that would be more familiar to Windows users.
I would bet the main reason is that KDE is way more willing to accept features and contributions outside of the typical use case than Gnome is.
I was puzzled why Valve chose KDE to be the default desktop for a touchscreen device.
The default software selection, especially when SteamOS 3.0 had launched, clearly showed that they picked a setup they wanted to use for themselves (my setup is heavily customized by now but I clearly remember VIM having been set as default text editor). If Valve was interested in Desktop Mode being primarily for touch use, they could go with Plasma Mobile instead of Plasma Desktop. Plain Gnome without any extension is not good to use as either desktop or handheld. The Gnome developers can't even make up their mind which shell to use for touch devices because they literally have two competing ones (Phosh and Gnome Shell Mobile).
You guys are using the touchscreen? You know there's a perfectly serviceable trackpad you can use, right?
The trackpad is the only way to really use the desktop, but if the touchscreen was better KDE still wouldn't allow a good touchscreen experience.
Bazzite is just straight up a better experience than SteamOS. Fedora backend with rpm-ostree is way better than what Valve has going on. And for Steam Deck, GNOME just makes more sense for touch interfaces.
Bazzite defaults to Plasma for Desktop Mode just as SteamOS. According to https://universal-blue.org/images/bazzite/installation/ Gnome is only the 4th installer choice.
Welp, there go my weekend plans.
I've been loving it on desktop, personally
HoloISO is almost the exact same thing, just without any support from Valve.
All public interest in HoloISO pretty much died when the author came out as a fanboy of Putin's war. The aforementioned Bazzite seems to be the best supported option these days.
Oh, I wasn't aware of that at all, my bad. Bazzite looks much more polished, as well.
I hope it does because the biggest problem for handhelds like the Ally is the atrocious experience as soon as you leave steam big picture. Armor Crate is buggy as hell and trying to click anything in windows with the joysticks is not fun. Not to mention the usual Windows shenanigans of “update every damn day” and “spam me with bs about one drive and angry birds”.
Yeah, I feel like the Steam Deck is the only handheld PC that could be a decent experience without trackpad, since it provides a console like experience. It's pretty unacceptable in my opinion to have windows handhelds forcing a windows desktop experience without a trackpad.
I imagine some of the smarter people at Microsoft are seeing the Steam Deck unfold and are realizing it's a potential threat. Desktop is dying, and gaming is one of the few segments still doing alright in the space. Microsoft wants to make sure games continue to be made for Windows even as mobile and consoles take over the lion's share of profits. They haven't been buying up studios just to prop up Xbox 😉. The Deck runs Windows games, and if compatibility ever reaches a point that the average gamer doesn't need to know they aren't running Windows, Microsoft is in big trouble. With the progress made just in the last five years alone, it's an eventual possibility.
Licensing is a cost in an already razor-thin market. If gamers won't care that a device isn't running Windows - they won't install Windows on it, and the OEM will just pocket the difference. Valve also has an advantage traditionally enjoyed by console manufacturers. They can sell it at no profit or even a loss, because Steam Store sales will make the money back.
So long as Valve keeps steady progress and improving compatibility, they will carve out their niche. If they can somehow get studios with major multiplayer games to provide official support, the chicken and egg problem will solve itself.
You can tuna steam deck but you can't tuna fish
What about the glue?
Not going to happen until NVIDIA proprietary drivers work well in Wayland
Not going to happen until NVIDIA proprietary drivers work well in Wayland
Maybe Valve could just release it and replace the download button with this to get the incompatibility message across:
You might want to check out update 545
Yes, I tested it. Some issues were fixed, but it’s far from being complete
I don't think SteamOS is a good desktop OS. It's designed for a gaming console, e.g. a handheld or gaming pc connected to a tv.
The desktop mode is great but the immutable filesystem isn't good for installing of system level apps that are necessary for day to day usage. E.g. kernel modules for OBS virtualcam, VirtualBox and similar.
Any Linux distro with Steam is a generally better experience for desktop usage. SteamOS is big picture mode by default, a desktop OS should open the desktop by default.
That's why I think people will be disappointed if Valve releases SteamOS for any pc.
Immutable OS's are increasingly popular. While some types of software are harder to install, the system being harder to break is very appealing. I know if I setup my wife/kids/parents with a Linux OS I would go with an immutable OS to reduce how much they could accidentally break.
Big thing is SteamOS needs a way to install traditional packages permanently. Other immutable OS's usually offer an option to reboot to install packages not otherwise available/viable through flatpak or distrobox/nix.
Look into Fedora Silverblue, immutable filesystem OSes have come a long way. Things like Toolbx allow you to install packages in sub-systems similar to WSL and flatpaks make all the grapical applications avaliable. Plus package installation doesn't pollute your base install with packages making the OS increasingly unstable.
I've used Fedora Silverblue for a while and it's still on a laptop that keeps itself up to date without any user intervention. The specific way SteamOS is immutable is the problem, namely wiping apps installed through pacman on updates. Most apps work in containers (flatpak, distrobox) but gaming-related software like the xbox controller driver xone and v4l2loopback for OBS virtual camera support do not work well with how SteamOS currently works.
My point is not that SteamOS couldn't be a great desktop OS, but that Valve focuses on solving a relatively narrow use case. This makes it not an ideal general purpose desktop OS, altough that is subject to change.
@Fubarberry a bit of newbie on these distributions, it seems that nvidia graphic cards are a nogo for chimeraos and holoiso. Has anyone some good experience with bazzite ?
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