vibe coding is great for a POC, but the defining difference between a POC and an MVP is that a POC is made to be thrown out, doesn’t have to work all the time (you can say “ah yup just need to give it a kick” when you’re showing it off and manually intervene)

vibe coding is good to show a basic, unmaintainable, non-production version of a feature of function, but then you need to take that and manually build it into your MVP - perhaps by copying some minor parts of the POC, but verifying every step

[–] the16bitgamer@programming.dev 12 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I just want to say that the V in this specific MVP wasn’t Viable

[–] pupbiru@aussie.zone 1 points 3 weeks ago

yeah viable is such a variable concept

i guess like… i have a friend that is a lab tech, and he vibe coded a stand alone HTML and JS page for their team to take CSV and filter it… the excel process they used before was horrendous… in that case, i guess that’s a viable product: it works, isn’t buggy (or at least bugs will become well known and able to be manually avoided or worked around)… i’d say that’s an MVP but wouldn’t be so if you wanted to productise it

[–] als@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Damn, you really shouldn't say that people of colour are made to be thrown out. That's fucked up (/s)

[–] eager_eagle@lemmy.world 2 points 3 weeks ago

or "oh yup, just need to give it a kick"

[–] bytesonbike@discuss.online 3 points 3 weeks ago

I took it for a test run to build out a API as a proof of concept to my superiors to show what we can do.

I then started on a real version, saving the vibe code version as a backup in case I could cherrypick code.

After recreating the basic functionality again but properly, I looked at the vibe coded project and threw it in the trash. Had zero reusability.

[–] null@lemmy.nullspace.lol 1 points 3 weeks ago

Even before that, it's great for bouncing abstract ideas around for how you might go about defining that POC.

[–] thebardingreen@lemmy.starlightkel.xyz 28 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

My experience working with a vibe coder hired by one of our clients is actually that's it great for MAXIMUM VP, as in a viable product made up of just under 40k lines of typescript, plus 90+ Node libraries for an app that amounts to a login page, a Square payment gateway and a user settings page (it's seriously just a signup page for a coastguard and weather alerts service that the rest of our team built in Python and Rust). It crashes if it can't talk to a database server that hosts no actual databases. It crashes if it doesn't have the Square API secrets as envars, but the LLM also hard coded them into the API calls. It actually crashes if you try to run it any way other than "npm run dev" (so I srsly set up a service that runs it as npm run dev, as the ubuntu user).

[–] robador51@lemmy.ml 12 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

For the first time ever I did some vibe coding this week. I needed what amounts to putting a file in a folder and watch until a file in another folder appears, with a monitoring utility.

I was very impressed with the definition phase. It was a back and forth about the spec until it was what I wanted. I then let it built.

This was quite interesting. It set up a scaffold, wrote tests and ran the tests, fixing errors as it went, then went on to finalize the app. Magic.

Finally it was done, so I go in to play with it. Riddled with bugs. Try to get it to fix them. More bugs. End to end spend a morning doing all this until I gave up and manually wrote what I need in about an hour.

Conclusion: Vibe coding is a complete waste of time. Worse: in the wrong hands it is dangerous. You need to be a pretty damn good programmer to assess the output, and if you are, why the fuck would you use it in this manner?

It reminds me a bit about the no-code/low-code evangelism of some years ago. To the novice it looks magical and a world of possibilities, and the road to riches. But in reality you can only use those things if you have decent programming skills, otherwise it's a path nowhere.

Need a quick demo? Sure, this might help the novice. Want something for production? Get a professional.

[–] MostlyBlindGamer@rblind.com 2 points 3 weeks ago

The thing about low code is the successful products in that field have their blocks built by experienced teams. I’ve heard of setting up low code apps via LLMs and that almost makes sense. They can only do as much damage as a bad project manager cosplaying a solution engineer, scrapping the whole exercise isn’t too bad, and they can be a nice demo for the client.

[–] abbadon420@sh.itjust.works 11 points 3 weeks ago

And these guys are coming to take our jobs. Watvh your back. /s

[–] sbeak@sopuli.xyz 10 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (3 children)

I don’t want to be that guy, but ‘s is for possession, or when it is short for “is”, like what’s or how’s being what is and how is. Just a plain s for plural, never ‘s. I don’t get how so many people get this wrong, it’s not that hard.

[–] farcaller@fstab.sh 7 points 3 weeks ago

OP should have vibecoded the title, chatbots know how to use apostrophes.

[–] Witchfire@lemmy.world 5 points 3 weeks ago

There is technically a rule that allows for 's, and acronyms are one of the possible uses

[–] NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I think you are wrong in this case. For example, many people would write X's when talking about multiple instances of the letter X. As another commenter said, there are exceptions and acronyms can be one of them.

But I upvoted you anyway because us pedants need to stick together.

[–] sbeak@sopuli.xyz 2 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Really? Damn, I did not that. English is a weird language.

[–] NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 weeks ago

The cool and/or awful thing about language (not just English) is that if enough people many the same mistake, it's no longer a mistake!

[–] lime@feddit.nu 10 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

oh hey an actual joke in programmer_humor, let's check the comments

[–] the16bitgamer@programming.dev 3 points 3 weeks ago

🥲

[–] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 7 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Minimum, sure.

Viable ...

[–] the16bitgamer@programming.dev 3 points 3 weeks ago

I going to point out the V wasn’t for Viable

[–] whatwhatwhatwhat@lemmy.world 7 points 3 weeks ago

It took me a minute to realize that “MVP” means “most valuable player” to most people.

Apparently I’ve been in tech far too long, and care about sports far too little.

[–] GreenKnight23@lemmy.world 5 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

know what's great for MVPs? language specific frameworks like ruby on rails.

runs like dog shit, but you can have a full fledged app in days or weeks instead of months.

AI can't do that.

[–] symbioticremnant@lemmy.world 5 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Modern Ruby runs great. I'm a little surprised Ruby made it as far as it did with how bad it used to be though

[–] GreenKnight23@lemmy.world 2 points 3 weeks ago

agreed.

modern ruby can even outperform python, php, and others.

rails is still dog shit slow. but it is better now. considering what rails does though, the performance tradeoff is negligible. proper indexing and query improvements are extremely beneficial to UX.

[–] cyborganism@piefed.ca 3 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

What the fuck is vibe coding?

[–] GreenKnight23@lemmy.world 7 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

it's an allegory for using AI for development is akin to coding with a vibrator up your ass.

sure it's fun and easy, but the end result is you smell like shit and you're unable to work after you've been caught.

[–] PattyMcB@lemmy.world 4 points 3 weeks ago

I laughed so hard at this

[–] cyborganism@piefed.ca 2 points 3 weeks ago

LMAO!!!!

[–] somerandomperson@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Telling an AI agent to code an app without knowing what the code does.

[–] vrighter@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

the most important thing then is to make a flashy website, and try to unleash that monstrosity unto the world

[–] somerandomperson@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 3 weeks ago

too late

[–] djcas9@feed.djcas9.com 3 points 3 weeks ago

Link, let's see the security. 🤣 https://x.com/eito_miyamura/status/1966541235306237985

[–] razen@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

One can do all the vibe coding they need but if they understand nothing what the AI is giving and also not verifying, things can go wrong very quickly.

[–] otacon239@lemmy.world 2 points 3 weeks ago

I was looking at open-source app builder toolkits the other day and they’re all “ask an AI to build garbage” wrappers. There were way fewer options for toolkit-style visual app builders because those can’t be loosely slapped together in a couple weekends.