this post was submitted on 25 Aug 2023
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Was there an alternative adjective to "clockwise" other than "the rotation you take around left hand"?

Also, how did all watch companies around the world agree on what the direction of "clockwise" is?

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[–] Spuddaccino@reddthat.com 162 points 1 year ago (12 children)

"Sunwise", and for the exact same reason.

Clocks go clockwise because their predecessors did. What were their predecessors?

Sundials.

How does the shadow go around a sundial? Well, sunwise, of course.

Counterclockwise, as said in another comment, was "widdershins", from a Middle Low German phrase meaning "against the way".

[–] NotYourSocialWorker@feddit.nu 25 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I find it interesting that in Swedish the opposite of sunwise is "motsols", i.e. counter sunwise or literally "against the sun". Sunwise is called "medsols", lit. "with the sun".

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[–] db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Widdershins needs to make a comeback. It's a cool word

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[–] dirkgentle@lemmy.ca 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I am trying to picture it, but I think the sunwise convention only works in the Northern hemisphere.

[–] Auk@kbin.social 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yep - in the northern hemisphere a sundial shadow will move from west to east in a clockwise fashion; in the southern hemisphere it still goes west to east but does so moving anticlockwise.

[–] XeroxCool@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And if I'm thinking about this correctly, people between ~20N and ~20S latitudes will have it reverse throughout the year and and sometimes be a straight line.

Wait, it's all anglo-centric?

[–] EldVrangr@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (2 children)
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[–] southbayrideshare@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I somehow read this comment in the voice of the cleric performing the "mawwiage" ceremony in Princess Bride.

Cleric: "Sunwise...." long, uncomfortable pause. "And for the exact same weason." Pause. "Clocks go clockwise because their pwedecessors did... and what were their pwedecessors?"

Humperdink: "Look, can we hurry this up?"

Cleric: "Sundials."

Humperdink: "Just skip to the end!"

Cleric: "Countewclockwise... as said in another comment... would be... widdershins."

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[–] Synthead@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yes but, how did people know that time went sunwise before the sun?

[–] sawdustprophet@midwest.social 15 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yes but, how did people know that time went sunwise before the sun?

Back before the solar system was fully formed, it was called "gaswise".

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[–] CheezyWeezle@lemm.ee 88 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Well, clocks are just mechanical sundials. Before clockwise, there was sunwise (or deosil), and clocks' movements are based off of the movement of a shadow across a sundial.

[–] Delusional@lemmy.world 21 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Used to be sunwise and counter-sunwise.

[–] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Ok, but how about before the sun?

[–] gnutrino@programming.dev 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Galaxywise and counter-galaxywise

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[–] OldManBOMBIN@lemmy.world 82 points 1 year ago (7 children)

A guy I know owns this clock, which basically proves that everything in life is pointless and arbitrary:

[–] kadu@lemmy.world 29 points 1 year ago

I find this deeply unsettling, please delete

[–] Buddahriffic@lemmy.world 17 points 1 year ago (3 children)

I might be evil because now I want a clock like that only with the 1 starting where the 4 is.

[–] OldManBOMBIN@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

I don't think you're evil, but there is definitely something wrong with you. lol

[–] brianorca@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

It wouldn't be that hard. Once you get a clock like this with the reverse movement, you can just open the face glass, remove the hands, and print a new graphic for the background.

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[–] 1luv8008135@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Weird, this feels easier to read. Less grating somehow.

[–] OldManBOMBIN@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)
[–] Diabolo96@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 year ago (7 children)

Hey, don't put us all in the same bag ! I am left-handed and i still got weirded out by it. He's just a weird guy that may happen to be left-handed.

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[–] Honytawk@lemmy.zip 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oh, you mean like the order of the Alphabet?

[–] OldManBOMBIN@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That's actually the only non-arbitrary thing in existence. If the alphabet wasn't in alphabetical order, we'd all be dead right now.

[–] ki77erb@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

This is correct. Alphabetical Order is one of the fundamental laws of nature. A universal constant.

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[–] EdanGrey@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I have one of these, it was a gag gift from a friend. I've had it up so long now though I have to double check which clock in looking at before I tell the time because I've got so used to it

[–] OldManBOMBIN@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

That's pretty cool. Also, your username contains an anagram of the name of the man who owns the clock from my comment. That's also pretty cool.

[–] rm_dash_r_star@lemm.ee 4 points 1 year ago (7 children)

Also why the seemingly arbitrary graduations, 24 hours, 60 minutes, 60 seconds. If it was say 10 hours in a day, 100 minutes in an hour, 100 seconds in a minute, seconds would be close to the same amount of time. Same with latitude and longitude, why 360 degrees in a circle with 60 minutes in a degree and 60 seconds in a minute.

[–] beefcat@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

These numbers aren’t arbitrary, they are from different base numbering systems.

60 can easily divide by 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 10.

12 can easily divide by 2, 3, 4, and 6 (notice how much overlap there is).

10 only divides easily by 2 and 5. Common fractions like 1/4 or 1/3 now require decimals.

Basically, base 12 and base 60 make it significantly easier to think and work in common fractions.

It is also historically significant, as base 12 used to be more common than modern base 10. Our timekeeping system dates back to the ancient Babylonians, who worked in base 12. This influence is still felt in other places, such as the fact that eleven and twelve have unique names in many languages rather than following the same pattern as everything that comes after them.

[–] themeatbridge@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

The short explanation is that those numbers are more easily divided by a larger set of denominators. 24 is divisible by 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, and 12. 100 is divisble by 2, 5, 10, 25, and 50. 60 is divisible by 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 10, 12, 15, 20, and 30.

Metric is great for scaling up and down ad infinitum, but it sucks for fractions. Fractions are easier for daily use without precision measuring equipment.

[–] Harrison@ttrpg.network 5 points 1 year ago

The units of time we use come from a bronze age civilisation that used base twelve instead of base ten. They'd count on their hands using the finger joints of one for single digits, and then the joints of the other for multiples.

[–] AlexisFR@jlai.lu 5 points 1 year ago

That's called Decimal time and revolutionary France already tried it.

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[–] DirigibleProtein@aussie.zone 68 points 1 year ago (3 children)
[–] Bo7a@lemmy.ca 9 points 1 year ago

I always heard it as 'deosil and widdershins'

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[–] Disregard3145@lemmy.world 66 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Turnwise and widdershins. I read it in a book once.

[–] GreatFord@lemm.ee 13 points 1 year ago

Deosil (sunwise) was the opposite of widdershins (against the usual). Both had a wide range of uses too, not just directionality.

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[–] oktux@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Good question!

The real answer seems to be "right" and "left".

Source: https://english.stackexchange.com/a/174112

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[–] Nemo@midwest.social 19 points 1 year ago

Deosil, which is the direction the shadow on a sundual moves (in the Northern Hemisphere).

[–] fubo@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Imagine you're in the Northern Hemisphere and you face east toward the rising sun. Over the course of the day, the sun will seem to move to the south, and then set in the west. This forms a "sunwise" turn, which is what we now call "clockwise" because we made clocks in imitation of sundials.

[–] loke@fedia.io 7 points 1 year ago (4 children)

In Swedish it's called medsols and motsols. The iteral translation is with the sun and against the sun.

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This turned out to be a surprisingly fascinating question lol.

[–] VoilaChihuahua@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

As someone who still confuses these "turn it around that way" - jiggles hand in vague motion- "oops no the other way" usually works just fine.

To your second question, the direction of clockwise is mostly influenced by sundials. In the northern hemisphere the shadows move in a clockwise direction, and so the early clocks made in the northern hemisphere mimicked that. In the southern hemisphere it's naturally reversed, but because so much of that hemisphere is either empty ocean or colonized lands, the clocks move in the same direction. Bolivia had a sort of flash in the pan moment in the news about a decade back for reversing their clock direction on a big central clock (think like big ben) as a way of staking their independence from a colonial past.

On the first question, I have no idea. But in Sweden they use terms that translates to "with the sun" and "against the sun" but I don't remember what they are without googling it.

[–] Omgarm@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Semi related: QI uploaded this bit the other day about an aboriginal tribe that can flawlessly pinpoint north/east/south/west.

https://youtu.be/0aAcYZPpfG0?si=E3xVhFcsCl8gDZpo

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