this post was submitted on 29 Nov 2023
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The Timberwolves now sit at 13-4, the current #1 seed in the Western Conference, almost 1/4 through the season.

Rudy Gobert defensive rating: 102.3 (#1 in the league)

KAT defensive rating: 104 (#2 in the league this year / averaged 109 historically)

Timberwolves: 106.6 (#1 in the league)

If they make the finals this year; are we still saying it was an overpay?

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[–] demarci@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (12 children)

If they make The Finals, then it's absolutely not an overpay; actually, I'd consider it an amazing trade.

The Timberwolves have never gotten that far and I don't believe they really had contending expectations, recently.

Even if they make the Western Conference Finals, then the trade was worth it. I feel you have to factor the franchise's history into this. The decade-plus of 'Spooky Wolves' discussion disappointed every single year.

If they finally get over that hump and appear to be a significant challenger come Playoff-time, then I firmly believe the trade should be considered well worth the price.

[–] WembyandTheWolves@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

If we win a round or two it’s not an overpay. People have no idea how shitty it’s been being a Wolves fan. The year we made our first playin we had awesome health and everyone else had shitty injury luck. We were not guaranteed at all to continue being in the post season last season or in the hunt this season.

[–] ElectricalMud2850@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (6 children)

Even if (big if, not putting the cart before the horse here) we have something like back to back WCF appearances, shit's worth it to me. We've been so fucking miserable for my entire adult life, I'm just begging for a deep playoff run.

The KG/Spree/Cassell year was so fun.

[–] Midwest_Hardo@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

I’ll be ecstatic if we win a playoff series

[–] WembyandTheWolves@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Fucking thank you. That’s my break even point. Anything beyond that is bonus. I’m hopeful for much more but I’m also realistic about what it takes to please me.

[–] BallIsKobe96@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Would have been interesting to see what would have happened last season if McDaniels doesn't break his hand.

[–] Eufosz@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (4 children)

See a realistic wolves fan

Make it past the first round first before even talking about the finals.

No hate but it’s difficult for teams to get deep into the playoffs With so many great teams in your conference

It’ll be a dog fight whomever ya’ll face but I’m really hoping to see a wolves/ kings first round match up

Would be great for both teams that have some playoff experience but haven’t won a series in what? 20 years.(id be happy as a neutral fan)

[–] WembyandTheWolves@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

man screw that. I don't want to see the Kings unless absolutely necessary. I'm rooting for them as a fellow poverty franchise.

[–] ScratchTwoMore@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)
[–] tenfingersandtoes@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

This please, but I worry about the Wolves being able to stop the Kings.

[–] LarryTatum@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I'd rather see both go far, I can see a Lakers Min first round with how both teams are going so far, wonder gow that matchup will go

[–] Raging-Timberwolf@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Nah let’s face the Mavs or Rockets please

[–] Pardonme23@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago
[–] Carth_Onasi_AMA@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I didn’t become a serious fan until Rubio was drafted. Not really a big football/baseball/hockey fan. So the Wolves have pretty much been the only team I follow/care about. I have no regrets, but this is the only time I’ve had pure joy watching them. The trade was worth it. We actually have a legit team now that is taken serious.

[–] timberwolvesguy@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I’m 30 and didn’t start following closely until 2007. I’ve known nothing but trashy seasons and essentially 3 gentleman’s sweeps. The play-in win with Pat Bev running around like we won the Finals was our first taste of actually winning the whole thing in what, 17 years?

Yeah, a few deep playoff runs (or at least making it to the second round for the next 3 seasons) makes the trade an easy win for us.

[–] Prestig33@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If we make back to back wcf and lose, is Finch gone? Or does he still have a long leash?

[–] AthKaElGal@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

wouldn't he be your team's most successful coach?

[–] WrinkledRandyTravis@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

He already is if you go strictly off record, he became the most winningest (most stupidest word ever) coach in franchise history just a few games ago.

Although Flip took us to the playoffs so many years in a row and capped it off with a WCF appearance, is the only Timberwolves coach ever to win a playoff series, and is basically the Timberwolves’ Vince Lombardi so “most successful” might be a tough title for some fans to relinquish

[–] heyiknowstuff@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago
[–] Billybobjoethorton@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Same reasoning why Kings fans are happy with the Sabonis/Hali trade. To break a 16 year playoff drought, have a center that can flirt with triple doubles nightly, get your pg to take a leap to another level, and still can get better and better.

[–] Andy_Wiggins@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

The thing about the Sabonis trade that doesn’t get talked about enough is how much it really helped Fox explode.

People forget how much Fox was struggling to play with Hali (really how much they were struggling to play together). People theorized after the trade happened that the Kings dealt Hali because he actually had trade value unlike Fox. But as soon as Sabonis joined the team, Fox took off and has been an all-NBA level player. So not only did they add Sabonis, but they actualized Fox (Sabonis does so much for his game). That’s the sort of thing that makes a deal a win-win.

[–] TryCatchRelease@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

It’s an overpay no matter the results, they simply could have paid less in the trade and paid over market. If you paid $100K per bitcoin right now, even if it’s worth $200K in the future, you still overpaid since you could have bought it for less when you bought it. Terrible negotiating from the FO, but I do hope it works out for you all (go Kyle Anderson!)

[–] thekeylimeguy@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Exactly, this year and next year are huge for them and it appears they may be turning that corner already with time to build before the playoffs pending health

[–] tomdawg0022@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If they make The Finals

Even if we get to the WCF and follow it up another solid playoff run (WCSF or WCF), I think I would consider the trade a W for us.

This franchise has all of 2 series wins and both were 20 years ago...we're not exactly awash in success.

[–] WrinkledRandyTravis@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I’ve come to peace with the resolution that it can be both a win and an overpay, it’s not necessarily just one or the other

[–] skrulewi@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Don’t tell me the wolves are spooky for real for real this year

[–] collinCOYS@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (4 children)

The other thing the trade does is put our young core in a winning environment every year. Look at what's happening with Cunningham and Green. They have been in losing cultures for the first years of their careers and developed some real bad habits. Tatum and brown came up in a winning culture and have developed better because of it

[–] Lets_Basketball@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Even a team that conceivably went “full tank mode” like the Thunder had the good fortune of CP3 turning his career around there, which led to SGA getting real competitive games at a young age while learning from a top player at his position. Then you have the 6ers who imbued “don’t worry just wait a few years” into Embiid and Simmons bones and now they can never seem to get it done in the playoffs. There’s definitely something to not letting your team toil in mediocrity or worse for too long of a stretch.

[–] AthKaElGal@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

it's just young players acquiring bad habits.

[–] AntiGrav1ty_@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Wish Wiseman, Kuminga, and Moody got that message...

[–] markmyredd@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Warriors has been bad at drafting and developing since they had their 1st title. lol

[–] EuphoriaSoul@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

What are the respective good and bad habits?

[–] lampshady@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

On a losing team maybe you don't make the right pass for the situation bc the guy your passing to sucks and you don't trust him. On a winning team/culture maybe you always make the right pass even if the shooter is slumping because you trust the process. Similarly on a bad team you feel like you need to force things to compensate and on good teams you don't.

[–] crsitain@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Nah look at Banchero. He was in a losing environment and is developing great.

[–] Intelligent_Pain_174@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

He has Joe Ingles on his team.

[–] Andy_Wiggins@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Generally speaking, one year likely isn’t that damaging (in OPs example, Ant was also on a bad team year 1). It’s the sustained losing that kills you, especially when the games get feel meaningless from the jump.

I’d also argue that Orlando wasn’t that bad last year. They had that horrid start (what was it, 5-20) but then were competitive the rest of the year and played like .500 ball and won 34 games (with a few tank games down the stretch to suppress that number).

But who knows. Some dudes come out of bad situations no worse for wear. Other dudes can never shake the bad habits. And the one must also wonder whether the bad habits were the cause of the sustained losing rather than the other way around.

[–] Same-Psychology-5116@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

If you factor in there history in regards to their shortcomings then you also need to factor it into the value of the picks they gave up. Historically, wolves have some of the most valuable draft picks

[–] Throwaway206818206@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I don’t think we’ll be using over pay if they win a ring or make it to the finals for sure.

However, I will still always think they gave up too much for gobert no matter what. Seems like the wolves treated it like a more serious bidding war than it ever was.

[–] DevilsReject1@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

If the Wolves got a ring, I'd trade another 4 picks to the Jazz just as a thank you gift.

[–] Livebird31@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

4? I would trade another 10

[–] Shame_On_You_Man@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

They won’t though

[–] K1NG2L4Y3R@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

If they are consistently good then those picks are not as valuable which makes giving up that many picks not too bad.

Speaking from hindsight they overpaid for Gobert but it’s not going to be franchise crippling if they truly have it figured out.

[–] Dudedude88@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

If you finish top of the league I think you break even. Post season success is cherry