I've been reading about battery breakthroughs for decades. And I remember when the latest in battery tech was alkaline, then Ni-Cd, then Li-Ion, and now LiPo. All of those have ended up in consumer products.

[–] GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca 32 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

Also, the battery pack for a cell phone 30 years ago was about the same volume and weight of an entire smartphone, with a capacity of about 500 mAh. They are also far cheaper if you account for inflation.

Batteries have improved incapacity by about a factor of 10 and the cost per watt-hour has reduced by about 99% in the last 30 year. All without a single advancement in the technology, apparently.

[–] olafurp@lemmy.world 4 points 4 months ago

I wouldn't call it a single advancement but hundreds. The materials might be largely the same but manufacturing is huge. When you roll up some metal to make a battery then increasing the number of layers is a huge challange when they're already tiny.

[–] Cocodapuf@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

All without a single advancement in the technology, apparently.

What do you mean by that?

I would say there have been a great many advancements in technology. I mean, that's what all these improvements are, right?

[–] GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca 8 points 4 months ago

It was sarcasm, which seems to be harder to convey in text than any number of battery advancements.

[–] Spur4383@lemmy.world 21 points 4 months ago (2 children)

You skipped Ni-MH there, that was major for not having the memory problems of Ni-Cd. We still use those in AA and AAA rechargeable batteries.

[–] FreeLikeGNU@lemmy.world 13 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Ni-MH production for EVs was effectively shutdown by Texaco and later Chevron through patent acquisitions.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_encumbrance_of_large_automotive_NiMH_batteries

[–] gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 2 points 4 months ago

Holy shit. I had no idea.

Chevron is pretty fucking evil for a lot of reasons, but we’ll add this one to the pile, I guess.

[–] TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com 2 points 4 months ago

totally TIL worthy

[–] Fermion@feddit.nl 5 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

Ni-MH ~~is~~ was also in a lot of hybrid cars.

[–] Pretzilla@lemmy.world 3 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Are they still making NiMH hybrid packs?

Lithium is far superior

[–] Fermion@feddit.nl 4 points 4 months ago

I don't know in general. I was recently shopping for a UX 250h and I know they only just switched to lithium for the 2025 model with the nx name change.

Toyota switched the camry hybrid from NiMH to lithium for the 2020 model year.

In my head I meant hybrid cars on the road, not necessarily in new production.

[–] Pretzilla@lemmy.world 10 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

A little pedantic note, LiPo is still a type of Li-Ion (maybe I got that right)

and the bigger recent breakthrough was LFP (Lithium iron phosphate / LiFePO4)

And probably safe to call Sodium-Ion and solid state the next big phases of development

[–] ammonium@lemmy.world 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

LFP is actually a relatively old battery technology, it's only now that the patent is expired that it's starting to breakthrough (outside of China, they somehow got a license if I understand it correctly).

[–] drosophila@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 4 months ago

You can buy sodium ion cells online right now. It's not the next phase, it's here.

[–] wreel@lemmy.sdf.org 0 points 4 months ago

Hey! Don't screw up Lemmy's Debbie Downer vibe!