Love that most of the world's governments came together and said "collective punishment is bad, we should make it illegal during times of war" and shit like this can still fly within any first world country.
this post was submitted on 20 Sep 2023
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Mildly Infuriating
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This sort of collective treatment seems awful "communist" for a system that claims to hate it so much.
Almost like they're okay with it when it means forcing their will and their hardship onto a group that is powerless to resist...
Or they could just find the vandal with the security cameras they no doubt installed in every single hallway to protect themselves against their own customers should they have to go to court 🤷
Oh wait, I forgot, we're trapped in tyranny.
I've been to several schools with zero cameras in residential buildings. I do not think they are as common as you think.
Hell, my school basically only had cameras in a few very specific areas inside any of the buildings on campus. The only ones I was aware of in our departmental building were, understandably, keeping an eye on the doorway into the explosives labs.
But that would require actual work and investigation! Why would they bother when they can just add on another $100 to everybody's rent bill for "repairs"
The HRE ain't gonna do shit since it hasn't existed since 1806.
How do they know it is done by someone within that community and not some random person?
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How do you think it works in condo buildings and residential co-ops?
They generally try to find a responsible party and bill them, file an insurance claim, use the general maintenance budget, and special assessments as a last resort.
Or in the wider world with public infrastructure and taxpayers
That's... how public infrastructure works?
You try to find the responsible party. If yes, they have to pay for repairs/damages.
If not, the tax money has to pay for it, as the infrastructure is needed.
And how is this substantially different?
Wasn't that their point?
This happened to me in college. The dorms were “locked” over the holidays and student residents were not allowed to even access the dorm building, when we returned back to school after new year’s, the hallway and apartment doors had been vandalized. The university passed the bill on to each of the residents of the building, even without any way we could have stopped it, since campus police would’ve arrested anyone found attempting to get into our dorms.
Happened to me, too. Some unknown people caused damage to a common room and they billed everyone in the building. I tried to email about it, but they didn't budge. I felt I had to pay it because the university threatens to withhold transcripts and stuff if you have outstanding fines.
Exactly what they did to me. I fought them on it. It was basically a shakedown racket and to get my diploma I decided it was better to pay and hold a grudge and have it written on my tombstone for posterity.
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This seems...unlawful...
Edit - for anyone who actually knows stuff about things, is it?
A lot can be legal if you agree to it. But they absolutely can't unilaterally declare this rule into effect.
Just don't pay, what are they gonna do? Sue you for damages that they admit themselves can't prove?
In a general sense, you are completely right, but this seems to be a college. By being a student, you've agreed to ALL the terms they hand you. If you decline, then you aren't a student anymore. Even if you pay EVERYTHING you owe except the unfair vandalism fee, you're not getting a diploma.
Fairly certain you could take something like this to court. You didn’t agree to this when you first signed the paperwork to live there, to turn around and say “okay, now you also have to pay us a surprise $10k or you don’t get the diploma you paid for” sounds hella illegal.
I'm not disagreeing that it's shitty as hell, but they could easily implement the rule in between semesters. You'd be agreeing to all the terms when you registered for the next set of classes.
Again, it's a super slimy thing to do, and it should be illegal, but you'd spend more fighting a University in court then you would just paying the fees, and you'd be at a MAJOR disadvantage when they show up with your signed agreement to abide by ALL campus policies.
Approximately 30 days before students are charged, a notice will be sent to community members in an effort to identify the responsible individual(s) for additional investigation.
Ah, so if you don't rat out the vandals, you have to pay
Weird that you wouldn't snitch on the dude who smears poop on the walls.
I'd like to think everyone would give you a pass for that.
Yeah I have a feeling this is more about paint on walls and that kind of thing. The phantom shitter has no friends.
That assumes you know who did lol
Mask out the vandalised area and put up a posting "free space available for graffiti art, email your sketch to blabla to get it approved "
The problem with this is it takes a while to normalize and self regulate. It demonstrably works, but it takes a long time for the dickheads and edgelords to stop making poorly drawn swastikas every day. Longer than any institution is willing to commit to anything.
My solution would be this:
Have a running total for damages caused by vandals and call it a “Vandalism Lottery”. When someone is caught vandalizing in the community, they win the lottery, but instead of getting money, they pay whatever that lottery amount is up to. $700,000? To bad! Work the rest of your life to pay it off.
And to keep it fair, the starting amount should be no less than $20,000.
On top of that, they should be required to clean up any identified vandalism for at least the next year.
It should NEVER be at the loss of residents, students, or taxpayers to recoup damage caused by idiots.
And yes, I'm salty because vandals caused over $50,000 to a brand-new waterfront park we had open this past year, and the Vandalism Lottery would have been a wonderful prize to the jackasses who got caught!
Even this I disagree with. It sounds like a good idea until the total cost is substantial, and they don’t want to foot the bill. So they watch for someone who does anything that can be misconstrued as vandalism and force them to foot the bill.
Not to mention, fining someone for $100 in damage nearly a million is honestly more unethical than the vandalism.
There’s a reason we don’t do this type of thing in the legal world, it’s easily taken advantage of, and unethical as fuck.
So they watch for someone who does anything that can be misconstrued as vandalism
Vandalism serious enough to be brought to court would be enough to win the lottery. If it's something petty, like doodling on a park bench with a pencil, then they don't win, but they should still do XX months of community cleanup.
As an alternative to the lottery, how about we charge the scumbags 2x the actual cost to repair the damage they caused. And 1 year community cleanup as a sign of goodwill.
Either way, the cost to society far outweighs the current cost of committing these crimes. Flip it around and see what happens.
Are you proposing that doodling on a bench with pencil should warrant months of community service?
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I really like this. You can't imagine how horrible every bathroom in my university was and as soon as one is fixed and repaired it get destroyed, and i mean destroyed as in stall doors being broken and sometimes partially or completely ripped , toilets getting beyond clogged and shit smeared everywhere, faucets broken,etc.
This is when you set hidden cameras in the hallways and have maintenance check hourly. The second something happens it goes to security footage. Who was in there?
It seriously only takes a couple people to do stuff like that and keep stuff wrecked for everyone.
They only installed cameras like last year but yeah it's the best solution. I think that if they give some jail time to the first POS they caught then it'd scare everyone enough to stop it from ever happening again.
You think you should have had to pay for repairs?
The problem is the "not my problem" mentality. This is a way to mitigate it.
Replacing it with a different problem where vandalism is subsidized and false accusations are incentivized. This won't mitigate the vandalism, it's just gonna be used to hurt people who did nothing wrong.
What a great way to ensure you'll never get donations from some specific alumni
Just send them all the bills you have because "this acacemic year, you are implementing a You Pay For Me Policy".
In fact, you could right away send them bills for every incident you don’t exactly know that they didn't cause it…
What is HRE?
Holy Roman Empire.
The Holy Roman Empire.
Yahuh... now do one for police unions.
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