It is very simple. When you are worried about yourself and your own actions that is normal. When you are concerned about what others choose, that is conservatism.
this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2024
-22 points (31.7% liked)
Asklemmy
43890 readers
1220 users here now
A loosely moderated place to ask open-ended questions
Search asklemmy ๐
If your post meets the following criteria, it's welcome here!
- Open-ended question
- Not offensive: at this point, we do not have the bandwidth to moderate overtly political discussions. Assume best intent and be excellent to each other.
- Not regarding using or support for Lemmy: context, see the list of support communities and tools for finding communities below
- Not ad nauseam inducing: please make sure it is a question that would be new to most members
- An actual topic of discussion
Looking for support?
Looking for a community?
- Lemmyverse: community search
- sub.rehab: maps old subreddits to fediverse options, marks official as such
- !lemmy411@lemmy.ca: a community for finding communities
~Icon~ ~by~ ~@Double_A@discuss.tchncs.de~
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
When you stop having a realistic view of porn. If you are using it as a simple pleasure and exploring sexual expression, there's no issue.
If you see you are using it too much, and is causing you problems, you may need to be aware that you are developing an addiction like any other.
If you start purposefully avoiding it even at the cost of your own comfort and stress relief, saying things like "porn wrecks your mind and sexuality", you are entering the current conservative, frustrating young people to manipulate them territory.
Like any vice honestly. It can be fun and enjoyable. Too much and then you need to get some help and it will affect you. Forcing it out of your life, however, is not actually dealing with your problems but rather just hiding from them. Finding the balance is the goal.
A true recovered alcoholic isn't someone who demands his friends stop drinking when they are around him. That's someone who is trying to hide from it. A true recovered alcoholic is someone who can see their friends enjoy a drink and say "no thanks" when asked.
Porn doesn't wreck your mind if you're a sensible person?
What are we talking about here? Easily impressionable people with no frame of reference? They're susceptible to everything. Well-adjusted people with prior information? They're susceptible to neither.
Bolshe morality? What in the samhill is that?
Porn wrecks your mind?
Porn stops your sexuality? Wtf.
The real question is do you recognize you're in some rabbit hole and that you shouldn't assume even your starting framework is agreed upon by most other people.
Edit: your edit only makes me wonder if you're satisfied with the algorithm funneling you to this sort of content and how your viewing habits reinforce it. Why wonder about people who think porn stunts their sexuality (still wtf?!?) when you can be watching literally anything else? Any idiot can post a YouTube video, doesn't mean you have to watch it.
What in the samhill
Reminded me of the Lois and Clark series
Hmm, not familiar with the connection. I stumbled across it while roaming Wikipedia. Origins are unknown possible from "Samiel", the name of the Devil in some opera. Or Sam Hill, a man in the 1800s known for using such foul language that his own name became a swear. Imagine that. While most strive to leave their mark on the world by leaving something good behind or raising good kids or helping someone in a life-changing way or whatever, he left behind his own name as a swear.
Are you arguing gooners don't have a problem?
Many people become addicted to pornography and yes it can wreck your mind and regular sex drive/habits just as any addiction can.
Please don't put some ridiculous binary statement in my mouth. There's miles of distance between "porn wrecks your mind" and "excessive porn use can contribute to mental health and relationship issues".
Porn wrecks your mind?
Porn stops your sexuality? Wtf.
you shouldn't assume even your starting framework is agreed upon
Why wonder about people who think porn stunts their sexuality (still wtf?!?)
You mentioned it multiple times but the only things you said about these statements were harshly dismissive and didn't provide any sort of nuance so why would it be ridiculous for me to respond as if there wasn't nuance in your opinion? I don't know what's in your heart/mind, only what you say.
I didn't pull those phrases out of thin air, they're from OP.
I didn't say you invent those phrases, I said that you harshly dismissed them with no recognition of the limited truth they hold, so why would you expect me to know you recognize the nuance?
How can I "put some ridiculous binary statement" in your mouth when I'm just reacting to the binary you already presented.
It like if someone says " all drugs are bad because they ruin your life".
and you say "wtf that's not true, drugs don't ruin your life" without mentioning that you're only talking about some drugs.
Obviously I'm going to point out that, no, drugs can ruin your life if you partake in them the wrong way, because drug addicts do have a problem and you dismissed it through ignoring it, even if that's not your intention. I can't know your hidden intentions, only what you post.
I think you have a very different perspective from me on what OP was asking and what this thread is. To paraphrase:
OP said "here are these extreme claims that seem strange to me, is this really what most people believe?"
To which I said, "wtf, no, those are way out there. You're in a YouTube bubble that doesn't reflect the mainstream nor anyone with a data-based position".
And you... seem to want to argue about the actual effects of porn. This is not a conversation about the effects of porn, this is a thread about how the yt video OP saw is propaganda. You don't need to expend effort to pick out the small bits of truth within misinformation and propaganda. If you want to discuss the effects of porn, post a thread and find someone who wants to have that discussion. Good luck.
I think you have a very different perspective from me on what OP was asking and what this thread is.
Indeed it seems so. I read it more as
OP: "I believe porn can ruin your mind and sex habits, how do we acknowledge this without delving into conservatism on the issue."
You: "wtf porn doesn't ruin your life, you're in a rabbit hole and your entire premise is wrong"
Me: "Porn can ruin your life, why would you suggest it can't? Look at gooners"
...
I feel you have to actually understand and acknowledge the real potential effects of pornography in order to find the line between recognition of harmful effects and conservatism.
"metapornography" is a term new to me.
I'd expect some sort of extra interesting sex education thing. But they're on about softcore porn or people looking attractive?
go figure. i felt confused about it and most people i've talked to says it's just some conservative bullshit wrapped in women enpowerment.
I'm pretty sure this does the opposite of empower
To conservatives, any porn viewing is a "porn addiction." That's their line.
Porn addiction is not on that line, not even close.
I maintain that what people mistake for porn addiction is just depression or possibly ADHD. Constant masturbation is a series of easy dopamine hits. If you quit cold turkey without making any other changes, you'll probably just replace it with social media or gacha games.
When you start proselytizing your feelings about it including through seemingly bad faith posts on the Internet that beg the question.
Both notions are pretty far out there tbh. There is nothing wrong with ethically produced pornography.
Conservatives: all glimpses of porn are automatically upgraded to ADDICTION.
Progressives: all porn actors are automatically upgraded to HUMAN TRAFFICKING VICTIMS.
you support ADDICTION and HUMAN TRAFFICKING
I think most people absorb a puritan idea of "removed" from society. Even like liberals, queer people, and sex nerds (people into kink) will have a version of this. For the right, it's usually a very misogynistic idea about how female sexuality and anything gay is evil. And this is usually what makes conservatives want to quit porn, though sometimes they won't admit it and they'll talk about like their essence or whatever.
So like you don't need to quite porn for the right reasons, you can just do it. But maybe spend some time thinking why you want to do it, and if it's because of some idea of removed or shame then you should also think about it you really want to hold those ideas, because they will ultimately make you just as miserable as the porn did.
Somewhere in the middle