this post was submitted on 14 Jun 2025
153 points (96.9% liked)

Work Reform

12542 readers
185 users here now

A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.

Our Philosophies:

Our Goals

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

cross-posted from: https://midwest.social/post/29825277

By popular demand, one last map to examine the absurdity of the American economy.

If you saw my map from yesterday that was up most of the day, please see the corrected version below. I done goofed hard on copying a column of state names. The original post has been corrected, but I will also post my previous two maps on this post for easy comparison.

Edit: the red map, for anyone unaware, is based on current individual state minimum wages and not the current federal minimum wage

top 14 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] catloaf@lemm.ee 13 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

So by this analysis, the state with the lowest cost of living is still at least $39/hr?

[–] ToastedRavioli@midwest.social 16 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago)

Yea, to afford a comfortable cost of living, as in 50% expenses, 30% discretionary, and 20% used for savings (emergency and retirement) and to pay down debts

E: Not sure why Im getting downvoted when I did not define these parameters whatsoever. This is just a reasonable calculation they did extrapolating from MIT’s barebones living wage calculations

[–] jacksilver@lemmy.world 6 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

How are you accounting for cities pulling up the averages for each state? For example New York has some dirt cheap places to live, but it's clearly being dragged up by New York City.

[–] Angry_Autist@lemmy.world 2 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

You'd be surprised how few people live in NYC currently as compared to years before. It's becoming a ghost town of the ultra wealthy and dwindling services and space for anyone else

[–] jacksilver@lemmy.world 1 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

It's still considered to be the most populous city in the US at around 7.9 million.

[–] Angry_Autist@lemmy.world 1 points 31 minutes ago

Doesn't look or feel that way when you walk it rn. So many closed businesses where there used to be busy streets

[–] ToastedRavioli@midwest.social 9 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

TL;DR: skip to the graphs at the end for the meat and potatoes

SmartAsset’s calculations for cost of living in 2025 are based on a healthy financial breakdown of 50/30/20 for expenses, discretionary, and savings/debt payment percentages. Which is a level of fiscal security everyone should be entitled to IMO

Their cost of living calculations are not based on “what is the bare minimum one can survive on” where your percentages look more like 66/33/0 or 90/10/0

Really the larger thing these maps show is how all of the money has been drained away from working people over the past 70+ years. The cost of everything has accelerated, for example $35 an hour is about the amount one must make to afford the median rent or median mortgage prices in 2025, but we get screwed out of the value that our labor creates as it gets siphoned upwards. Most Americans survive on credit, which they wouldnt have to do if wages had kept up with inflation the same way that rent did since an era before neoliberal economic policy wrecked everything. If they had, then people would be making about $35 an hour. Considering we produce such massive value with our labor, it makes perfect sense. But allowing wages to stagnate is obviously beneficial to those with concentrated wealth, be it companies or individuals

If in 1958, a salary of $6,514 a year could cover the cost for a family of four then that should show you how ridiculously expensive everything has become. Modern families have two income earners and still cannot afford comfortable cost of living, which is over double what it costs for a single individual. If both of those income earners were paid at minimum $35 an hour, then families would actually be much closer to affording COL for a family of four. But they would still need additional income to reach the level of 50/30/20 comfort.

People struggle to understand just how far off the modern American worker is from the financial security that was had by the average male worker or median household in 1958. If we were to draw a direct comparison to that situation and say everyone should get paid enough to support a family of four individually, like you could back then, then everybody would have to be making like $80 an hour due to the massive inflation in costs that wages have not remotely kept up with.

Households in the 1950s had practically zero debt, in comparison to modern households which are absolutely drowning in it. Americans right now hold, collectively, over 1 trillion dollars in just credit card debt. On average each American holds over $6k in credit card debt, which would be over 10% of the average salary earner’s income ($61k). Again, just on credit card debt and nothing else. In 1950, all debt owned by the average household equated to only 2% of their income. Two percent. And people were way worse off financially in 1950 than they were by 1958

Even if the federal minimum wage were $35 per hour, on average people working for that wage would still be unable to afford to live comfortably at 50/30/20 without working a second job. Meanwhile, real actual minimum wages in nearly 10 states are still at $7.25 an hour. Let that sink in for a second. There are people close to getting paid literally 5 times less than what it costs to live anywhere near a base level of comfort. That doesnt even go into agriculture, where the federal minimum wage is even lower

Our economy is massively fucked. Were long past a crossroads point where, in order to reach a point of sustainability, we either have to pay people more or have legitimate social services like universal healthcare and childcare. Continuing down the same path is doomed to fail just based on simple logic. All of the people’s money has disappeared into the pockets of the 1%, who provide nothing with their hoarding. They create something of value by spending, but their hoarding massively outweighs their spending and will only continue to do so without intervention

47% of households, not individuals, are below the amount of income for one individual to live comfortably.

In 1958, about that same percentage of households were below an inflationary equivalent income, but the difference was that at $5k-$6k a year they were affording COL for their entire household. Being below the median of income was not such a crushing situation as it is today.

Only 1 in 44 American households made over the equivalent of $170k today, in the ultra wealthy category. Thats 2% of them. Probably 20% of households today make an excess of $170k, with a handful of them hoarding an insane amount well beyond what a household that makes $170k a year could ever feasibly hope to earn.

$170k is still $7k shy of comfortable cost of living for a family of four in Mississippi, and about half of what it costs in Hawai’i, Cali, Mass…

Therefore, most people making the equivalent of a top tier bracket income in 1958 would not be able to afford the average cost of living at basic financial security in 2025. You would have to practically have been a 1%er back then just to be comfortable today

Even the richest guy in 1958, J Paul Getty, was worth only $1B. The equivalent of a “meager” $12B or so today. Elon Musk has $433B and hes not even lonely up there.

If we capped net wealth at $12B and took away everything else above that point, there would still be 812 more billionaires than in 1958, and the US would immediately have $5T to begin rectifying the massive dysfunction in our economy

[–] RunawayFixer@lemmy.world 4 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago) (1 children)

At first glance that top map already looked bad, but then I zoomed in on the legend and the cutoff for the white areas is an annual deficit of 60.000 ... What a ridiculous scale, that entire map should be blood red.

[–] Angry_Autist@lemmy.world 3 points 8 hours ago

Any rational perspective on current wealth inequality is naturally shocking

And people avoid shocking things

The only way to get traction is to kind of pretend things are halfway normal

The reasonable, rational people who are absolutely freaked out by the French Revolution levels of wealth inequality are marginalized and sidelined and told they are overreacting

FOR THREE FUCKING DECADES

Fathers with hungry children will be in the streets before the end of summer

[–] Steve 5 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago) (1 children)

I'm pretty sure the cost of living numbers are for a household, not an individual.

So unless we're looking to get back to single income households, the min wage should be divided by two.

[–] ToastedRavioli@midwest.social 6 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago) (1 children)

No, these are using the cost of living numbers for an individual. Cost of living for a family of four is over 2x higher by their same calculations.

So for two individuals making $35 an hour they would be close to affording comfortable cost of living in the cheapest state. Or it we were to make it equivalent to one individual’s income being enough for a family, they would need to be earning like 80 an hour

As I showed in my longer comment, this would make the modern minimum needed to afford average COL raising a family equivalent to a top tier income in 1958. Basically unless someone was a 1%er in 1958 they wouldnt be able to live comfortably today. That is how unsustainably far down our wages have stagnated. 47% of households make less than what it costs for one individual to live comfortably. The median income today might be at a roughly equivalent point when adjusting for inflation, but it is brutally low in comparison to what one can actually buy with what that same value of money bought someone in 1958

[–] Steve 4 points 9 hours ago

Well damn then.
That's extra depressing.

[–] danc4498@lemmy.world 3 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

I would like to see a graph of the percentage of people earning minimum wage in every state. It seems like minimum wage is no longer a thing.

[–] ToastedRavioli@midwest.social 2 points 9 hours ago

Either way, the average American worker who is salaried even earns less than $35/hr.

Countries with similar or slightly lower wage parity with us tend to work 30 hour weeks, have more vacation time, have universal healthcare, childcare, etc. in lieu of paying people such high wages. So they can still survive. In the US we have no supports like that reducing costs, and we also dont get paid well enough to make up for that