So can they give sin bin to a player without a yellow?
How many players from same team can get sin bin at a time or within that 10min period?
this post was submitted on 28 Nov 2023
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game is well and truly GONE
No thanks
Fuckin what? Bin VAR and stop all this nonsense. Let’s just go back to playing the game…
VAR isn't the problem.
Poor use and badly constructed rules around its use is the problem
Okay... what is the problem people have with sin bins (aka orange cards)?
People think that removing a player for ten minutes is so mind-bogglingly complicated that we can't possibly make it work, despite grassroots officials doing it across england for the last three years.
My problem is how easier than other sports it is to waste time in football.
Rugby? If you're down one man you need to bust your ass to pass time.
Football? Foul someone, get in front of the ball; spend a minute for a throw-in or a goal kick. Fake an injury.
Before introducing sin bins, I need these anti-football behaviours addressed.
They can't enforce the rules already in place, are we to believe they could handle this whole new system? Call me a cynic but I don't have much faith.
People live in this dream world where the rules of football never change.
From 1950-1990 the fundamental make up of the game changed absolutely loads. 2 points for a win, no penalty shootouts, pass backs, no red card for tackles from behind, offside if you're level.
Football isn't some holy doctrine that has always been like this so I have no idea why people are opposed to further positive change.
Let's try and ruin football even more
Gonna end up with a 3rd half of just stoppage time
Also imagine VAR taking 5 minutes on each sin bin decision on top of what we have already
If they had a sin bin and somehow decided the way to implement it was "we will review every sin bin decision and then put the player in the bin" rather than "we will put players in the bin and then review the decision, inviting them to rejoin the game before their time in the bin is up if the binning was unjust" that would be insane.
The ten minute sin bin rule works great in rugby for yellows. I've thought for a long time it should be brought into football. Provided they mic up the refs and allow us to hear their deliberations.
It works because there's not so much of an advantage, and it's a lot harder to get yellows.
Tactical fouls have had a huge negative effect on the product on the field. This rule makes them worse to commit so hopefully it limits them.
Let's try and ruin football even more
God you all are so stuck on tradition. Change is ok. The sport isn't perfect.
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Not sure about the sin bin thing before I hear more but one thing I think Football has needed for a long long time is allowing only the captain to approach the referee.
It's frustrating to watch when a foul or something happens and then you get half the pitch sprint over to the ref to try and influence him into making some kind of decision.
Having the ref's micced up so you can hear a conversation between them and the captain would make for good viewing whilst also improving the overall game I think.
Also the new trend of when a foul is given all the opposition players nonchalantly run over or next to the ball to stop a quick free kick. So frustrating. In rugby that free kick would be advanced 10 yards.
Advancing a free kick isn’t always beneficial in football though. It has been tried before.
Not at all serious suggestion, loosely based on some NFL rules, where the non-penalised team can choose between two outcomes:
Let the other team choose whether to advance it 10 yard or give the player a 2 minute sin binning.
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100% agree. I'm at a point of just card anyone who yells at the ref. It's insane how much time is wasted just watching grown men bitch and someone to stand one foot from the ball until the ref makes them back up.
if we’re going to go full hockey we should let players fight too
This is class, would rather them do it for professinal and intentional fouls that dont quite equate to a red but a yellow is not enough
Biggest issue with those fouls is that the rules currently only caution players if advantage isn't played.
So defenders can blatantly impede an attack and impact it heavily, but if attackers keep the ball and a free kick isn't given to there is no punishment.
Is that specific to professional fouls? Because referees are 100% allowed to return to a foul they played advantage on and give a card. I've never heard of the laws stating they cannot.
Biggest issue I have with the sport is how binary a lot of the rules are despite how low scoring it is. Sending offs and penalties basically kill a lot of games but there is basically no middle ground to them really. Sin bins are a great start imo, next I would love more indirect free kicks in the box.
Don’t copy Ruby , Ruby is rubbish
rather ice hockey , let the guys fight it out. Winner gets the free kick
I think this would be horrendous, you'd just see the most negative time wasting anti-football as teams try to play out the period with reduced numbers.
Feels like sin bins for tactical fouling is just creating even more problems rather than just up how often yellow cards are given for them.
If they do this, they need to implement a mechanism whereby incorrect yellow cards can be rescinded.
Something along the lines of the tennis appeal system.
It’s not a bad idea in principle, but it’s just another way for officials to make inconsistent decisions.
100% and another variable to bet on
VARiable
And without "net play time" it's gonna be even MORE inconsistent. Some players will lose like 2 minutes of actual game play, while other may lose 8/9...
It's not really another way though is it? Or rather, or it's not adding more decisions to be made. Previously it was "Do I give this person a a yellow or nothing for saying that to me" and now it's "Do I give this person an orange or nothing for saying that to me".
In that specific situation you almost feel like the hypothetical orange card for a sin bin could work like so:
- orange, yellow = off
- yellow, orange = sin bin
- orange, orange = sin bin
- and a third orange is always a red
This way referees who worry about being blamed for "ruining the game" with an early double yellow might punish players/teams where they'd otherwise find any excuse to avoid the second yellow.
This really would allow for more inconsistent decisions but it would facilitate punishing behaviours that ought to be punished but which routinely go unpunished.
The rules ("Laws" I know) keep getting written to be more objective, but the pursuit of objectivity is foolish when a lot of the decisions are always going to be subjective. Increasing the level of subjective discretion could actually make refs feel empowered to make calls they're otherwise hesitant to make because everything is so binary and clashes with the human element. Or it might not, but the situation now definitely needs fixing somehow... all that can go wrong is a different wrong.
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So give the ref's another tool to dictate the flow/outcome of games. What could go wrong.
The key thing about sim binning is it SHOULD make it harder for a referee to fuck up.
This is because there’s a huge difference between a yellow card and a red card both in terms of what warrants one and also the consequences. The addition of a sim bin makes this difference smaller
More things for city to get away with. Things being at the referees discretion isn’t going to go well. Especially something like this
By adding another sanction other than a yellow card or red card I think it will just add to the shit show lead to even more inconsistencies and talking points around refereeing decisions
The VAR stuff yesterday, Sin Bins today. It's like an advent calendar of ways to ruin the most popular sport in the world. I'm looking forward to seeing what dogshit idea they'll give us tomorrow
Without changing the rules to net play time (e.g. two 30 min halves) this is gonna be a MESS.
The idea is fine, but when one team has a sin bin and they start wasting time and in the end the player is out for like 2 minutes of actual game play... while in other case a player is out for 10+ (or whatever it ends up being) people are gonna be mad.
This is a good idea imo a yellow card for some of these tactical fouls isn’t enough
You should never be incentivised to break the rules in a game. Cynical fouls have been a plague for a long time.
Sin bins were piloted in 2018-19 and led to the Football Association reporting a 38% total reduction in dissent across 31 leagues.
They were then introduced across all levels of grassroots football from the 2019-20 season in an attempt to to improve levels of respect and fair play.
The rule change was then implemented up to step five of the National League system and tier three and below in women's football.
This echoes my experience of them in grassroots 11 a side and sanctioned small sided football (in 5-7 a side they are two minutes).
I don’t see why they wouldn’t also work in professional football.
At grassroots level they have the big advantage of not having to deal with all the paperwork and admin of fining players.
One example I’ve seen them used quite well in is where you have a handbags at dawn type scenario with a bit of a melee and some pushing and shoving. A sin bin each for the two main antagonists tends to calm the game down without needing such drastic action as a red card.
If it’s just a trial then I don’t mind - curious to see what the result is.
Players will waste time like crazy until their teammate is out of the bin.
Pre-VAR I would have been all for this, but I can only see this lengthening the game even more and introducing another source of uncertainty and disagreement.
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