this post was submitted on 23 Oct 2025
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[–] BertramDitore@lemmy.zip 87 points 1 week ago (20 children)

The democratic establishment has labeled him a communist one day, a Nazi the next day and an antifascist another day. You can’t be an antifascist and a Nazi at the same time.

I listened to the entire Pod Save interview with him, and I’m convinced he’s a solid dude who made some bad decisions when he was younger. He owns up to absolutely everything, and says he has learned from it. He sounded completely genuine to me.

His background is really important and honestly explains all of this controversy away. He was in combat in Iraq and Afghanistan for multiple tours, and he talks an about how much that fucked him up. He struggled for a long time and shitposting was one of his outlets. Who among us hasn’t regretted something we’ve posted? Owning up to and learning from it is the key.

If we want to stop electing vanilla spineless establishment candidates, the alternative is electing normal people who haven’t spent their lives hiding themselves from public view to maintain a “clean” persona. Nobody is perfect, everybody has made mistakes, and to me the strength of a candidate comes through most clearly when they take responsibility and demonstrate how their current self has evolved from their younger selves.

He seems like an awesome candidate to me.

[–] BrianTheeBiscuiteer@lemmy.world 31 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Let's just hope he doesn't have a stroke before getting into office. 😒

[–] njm1314@lemmy.world 21 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Y'all got to be careful with this. Because some people actually believe a stroke is what caused Fetterman to be what he is now. Instead of the actual truth which was he was always this and people just didn't bother to, you know, actually check on his background and his past statements. You can't fall for campaign rhetoric and think what they say when they're running for something is who they really are. I say this because frankly it seems extremely relevant on this topic. Who is this guy really?

[–] tocopherol@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

For REAL, this Platner dude is going to get elected and turn out to be a literal social fascist and people will be shocked somehow. Do people forget that a candidate can just say whatever they want to get your vote?

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[–] BertramDitore@lemmy.zip 15 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Ugh so true. Fuck Fetterman.

[–] JigglySackles@lemmy.world 9 points 1 week ago

He seemed to have some cracks before he got elected that came out later on after his stroke fully dropped him into magat territory

[–] SailorFuzz@lemmy.world 24 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (18 children)

100% this.

Leftist out here doing stupid purity tests, looking for some fairy tale candidate messiah. Gatekeeping anyone who isnt some perfect being. Because that's representative of the normal human experience......

The tattoo thing was ALWAYS overblown. Anyone who knows marines, especially young shithead marines, knew that tattoo thing was stupid. I believe that he and his fellow marines didn't know what it was when he got it. Because most people just learned what it was. So many people just now, this week, hearing the word "totenkopf" for the first time in their lives and feigning outrage.

I'll even give you that maybe he found out later, knew what it was, but didn't have it covered. And why?

Because it didn't matter. That's not what the tattoo meant to him, and its not what anyone around him thought it was. He had no pressing reason to cover it. Maybe it even served as a reminder of his shithead past.

It wasn't until he got into the public eye when a bunch of terminally online nitpickers lost their shit that it actually became an issue to him to fix.

And he did fix it IMMEDIATELY.

And I've yet to see anyone who smugly reacted to the initial story with "so he got it covered right? right?" eat their words. Instead they've doubled down and moved the goal posts to "well, he should have had it covered forever ago". Insufferable bullshit.

My brother in law, also a prior marine, had tattoos of clovers. Because he's Irish and thought they were cool. It wasn't until after his service that he learned that clovers are common with skinheads. And because he want a job in teaching, he got them covered.

This shit happens all the time. People making a stink about it are so far out of touch. They either need to touch grass, pull the stick out of their ass or the silver spoon out of their throat.

The privileged pearl clutching to instead defer support to another Biden/Pelosi/Schumer corpo dinosaur is pathetic.

[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 3 points 1 week ago

Dems are great at talking themselves out of EVERY candidate, leaving us nothing but MAGAs.

Could you imagine if a strong, intelligent person like Elizabeth Warren was president? America, and the world, would be a much better, far less chaotic, place in the universe.

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[–] Nefara@lemmy.world 10 points 1 week ago (1 children)

This right here. He's had to work for his principles which means he's more likely to stick by them. I believe he means well and wants to step up, not just get power and bribes or maintain the status quo. Nice to see how scared the billionaires are of him.

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[–] Vupware@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 week ago (5 children)

If it “fucked him up”, why did he work for BLACKWATER after his discharge from the military?

[–] BertramDitore@lemmy.zip 21 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (4 children)

That’s a totally legit question, and the host followed up with that same rebuttal during the interview. I won’t get his exact wording right, but his answer was something to the effect of him still being fucked up when he went back as a contractor, but thinking that seeing things from the other side might be better (pretty sure he worked in diplomatic security as a contractor). But it turned out to be worse, and seeing it from that side ended up being the thing that convinced him how pointless it all was. He also said it was the only thing he was ever good at, so he didn’t feel like he had any other options. Makes sense to me even if it’s not something I would ever do.

[–] Gust@piefed.social 24 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Coming back to the civilian world is hard as fuck, especially if you woke up during your time with the military. You get home and people call you a hero for what amounts to crimes against humanity, and if you try to explain the horror to them you get labeled crazy and dangerous. Nobody wants to hear that their government is run by mass murdering psychopaths and nobody wants to believe that "defense" is a myth that tricked their friends/family into participating in said mass murder. I was lucky enough to have the financial and emotional support to spend a year just working on myself, but i still have times where something will remind me of what I've seen and been part of and all I can do is hide myself and cry, and it still makes me uncomfortably furious when I hear people who have never experienced meaningful violence in their lives wish it upon others. I completely understand why some people who get home and immediately have to work to survive turn to a career with people who can at least understand/accept them and their trauma. It can feel like the only other option is isolation until inevitable suicide.

[–] BertramDitore@lemmy.zip 18 points 1 week ago (1 children)

That’s such a valuable perspective, thanks for sharing your experience.

The fact that the people pushing against Platner—by mischaracterizing his personal growth and discounting his trauma—are the very people who sent you guys to war unnecessarily, makes it even more infuriating. This is a disgusting move from Democratic leadership.

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[–] Nefara@lemmy.world 29 points 1 week ago

His website has some good policy positions.

He wants election finance reform, believes in environmental protections, medicare for all, protecting small businesses and is anti-billionaire. Seems like the right kind of anti-establishment populist and it's refreshing to see someone so unapologetically progressive.

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 11 points 1 week ago (13 children)

Discussion point: Graham Platner has some very questionable aspects to their backstory.

I say this as both an unabashed leftist, and a veteran. I was downloading MP3's of Democracy Now! and discussing Zinn with my section chief in 2003.

I propose the following material for review:

Don Lemon and Wajahat on the matter of Portner

Humanist report on Portner

TYT on Platner

Breaking points on Platner

I say this as someone who has met with Platner and as part of an organization I volunteer with, we endorsed Platner about 5 days before this came out. I've been on the endorsements committee, and we've never previously had to rescind an endorsement.

I'm interested in what you, Lemmy, have to say on this matter.

[–] cecilkorik@lemmy.ca 10 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I think we have to be very careful who we vote for these days. All candidates and parties are leaning into dishonesty and misdirection even more than usual, as they can see it being so very successful in the recent past, and they will continue to use it and push the boundaries on how much and how blatant manipulations they can get away with. What they say and what they actually do are trending in very divergent directions.

On the other hand, when we start looking for non-establishment candidates who haven't been vetted and groomed for most of their professional lives, we need to understand that many of them, being actual humans, are going to have been wrong and stupid in the past, as we all are sometimes, and some of those things may be forgivable and some may not. In the age of social media, this is almost guaranteed to happen. The internet always remembers, and oppo research is as easy as shooting fish in a barrel.

One of the things I think we need to remember in this case is that some humans are still genuine creatures of thoughts and feelings and emotions that don't always immediately lead us to a good place, and that people can and should improve and change and grow throughout their lives as their experiences do. If I was going to be judged on the political ideology I supported when I was an idiotic 15 year old no one would ever take me seriously ever again. But that might be a mistake. Because I like to think that I've grown quite a bit since then. I've read Plato's Republic, understood most of it, and agreed with some of it. I consume a lot of information from a wide variety of sources, some of that information is not so good and sometimes it leads me astray. I'll take responsibility for those mistakes, and I'll genuinely try to do better. And I think other people should be given at least the opportunity to own their mistakes too. Instead of immediately dismissing somebody that said some bad shit once upon a time, go to the next step and ask them what they think about it now. Then ask them why they changed their mind, which is the much more important part I think.

Granted, some people are just predators and opportunists, and will say whatever they think their current audience wants to hear, including what you want to hear. Distinguishing these types of the people from the people who have genuinely changed is not easy and I don't have an easy answer for how to do it. I'm wrong most of the time when I try too. I don't pretend to be a good judge of character.

I'm preaching this point of view in the hopes that other people, who are perhaps better judges of character than I am, can find some way to identify the difference themselves. Because we desperately need to find a way to put some genuine people in leadership roles. Our current system of democracy clearly isn't doing it. For this moment in history, I think we need a philosopher-king.

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 5 points 1 week ago

I think I agree strongly with this. The dude has MUCH explaining to do, but he deserves the oppurtunity to do so. When I've seen him speak publically, he's a once in a lifetime speaker. But dude did get nazi tattoo. Dude did work for blackwater. Those are extraordinary things, which he also hasn't denied or deflected.

And extraordinary things require extraordinary explanation. I don't think these are deal breakers, but surely a period of explanation and reflection is warranted.

[–] PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S@lemmy.sdf.org 8 points 1 week ago (1 children)

The four tours and Blackwater employment made him a Nazi before his tattoos did 😮‍💨

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 14 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Four tours, as a veteran, like.. I'm not excusing it, but some of the most anti-fascist people I know did multiple tours. I saw the writing on the wall and didn't re-enlist but everyone's situation and place that they are is different.

Of the people who have done several orders of magnitude more work to stop fascism, real, physical, on the ground work, all of them are military service members who saw active duty. One did two tours, and was at Falluja, and another had his humvee blown up from underneath him when command told his company to go drive a road they knew for a fact had IED's. One went on to be a DJ (actually he might do lighting idk), the other became a nurse and worked directly with Dr. Faucci at the CDC. Both were raised extremely conservative, and because they were given an opportunity to become a person they actually wanted to be, they changed.

[–] PM_ME_VINTAGE_30S@lemmy.sdf.org 5 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Yeah I basically agree with you here about your comrades based on the information you have given me, but the thing is you're implicitly conditioning your judgement of your comrades on their behavior after their K tours, I was implicitly (and now explicitly) conditioning my judgement about Platner on his four tours and Blackwater employment plus his behavior after that. Like I know people can change, IMO that is the thesis of my worldview, but Platner has not provided sufficient evidence that he has changed for the better. Furthermore, someone doing K > 1 tours is not just an ordinary evil thing, it's an incredibly evil thing, so forgive me if it takes a lot lot lot of good to be done before I start to consider their debt to humanity paid off.

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago

Furthermore, someone doing K > 1 tours is not just an ordinary evil thing, it’s an incredibly evil thing, so forgive me if it takes a lot lot lot of good to be done before I start to consider their debt to humanity paid off.

And thats totally fair.

[–] BrianTheeBiscuiteer@lemmy.world 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Follow the money. Maybe he's a shill and maybe not, but at this point I'd be very surprised if the oligarchy relied solely on voter appeal to get their candidate in office. If the usual suspects start running the usual "he's a communist" campaign then I'd say it's pretty safe they don't support him.

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 6 points 1 week ago

the usual “he’s a communist”

They running that at the same time they saying he's a secret nazi

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)

From someone with absolutely no horse in this race I feel this is looking a gift horse in the mouth. No matter how bad he turns out to be (which, yeah, I don't think I'm convinced he'll be a principled anti-imperialist in office), he's not going to outdo establishment democrats by much. The way American democracy is going it's worth the bet, I think.

[–] FinnFooted@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

For this race, I agree. The worst he can be is a Fetterman... Who sucks but is still better than fucking Dr. Oz.

But be careful with this line of thinking. It's very similar to how the right ended up voting for Trump. It's actually how a lot of really awful governments gained power. "Anything different" than the current catastrophe does not inherently mean better.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

My point was more that you lose if you get anything to the right of an outspoken progressive, and given the speed of Trump's consolidation of power the amount of loss is essentially unchanged. Therefore, better on someone who might realistically be an outspoken progressive is the optimal move. It's kind of like "you can get bitch slapped, or you can toss a coin and you either get bitch slapped extra hard or get a cookie." The damage is being done either way, so you might as well bet on the cookie.

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[–] WatDabney@sopuli.xyz 4 points 1 week ago

I think Platner isn't as skilled at avoiding establishment Democrat smear campaigns as Mamdani is.

[–] kewjo@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago

either a Nazi or a dumbass, neither make a good candidate imo.

[–] FinnFooted@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Im pretty wary... i think hes probably got a bit of authoritarian streak and probably got this tat when he was young and dumb and in the military which leans right. I also think people change and he has changed. I think he's taken a hard left on the economy and class consciousness.

But is his authoritarian streak gone? His reddit comments show that at the time of posting he had little sympathy for sexual assault victims and was at the very least kinda weird about black people. Hes also very pro gun, which I dont find to be an inherent issue and I even agree the left needs to be more prepared and armed, but when lined up with other problematic views it stresses me out. And I dont realllly trust all of his hand waving around the tattoo and reddit comments.

But maybe should we embrance that hes a bit of a bulldog in an era when the left is so toothless? Also its almost impossible to do worse than Susan Collins lol.

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[–] Ancalagon@lemmy.world 3 points 1 week ago (3 children)

What's the issue with mills?

[–] network_switch@lemmy.ml 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

If elected, she’d be 79 years old when she’d be sworn in as a freshman congressperson. Senate terms are 6 years. Solid shot at another democrat dying in office again with this one

Platner polls well and is much younger and has run very well with young people and progressives. He polls well against the incumbent republican. The talk for months before Mills entered the race was that Schumer was trying to get her to run

Now there’s stuff coming out about Platner and the Maine race may be screwed regardless. Mills is a bad pick anyways. Biden 2020 level pick for the same reason of too old and not setting up younger generations. Even 60 years old is solid for 2-3 terms before you really get scared that they’re going to Dianne Feinstein themselves in office

[–] dontsayaword@piefed.social 7 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I get the sense she is a business-as-usual Democrat

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[–] SailorFuzz@lemmy.world 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Another Pelosi/Schumer democrat.

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