this post was submitted on 29 Nov 2025
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[–] arc99@lemmy.world 5 points 7 hours ago

It's a pity other platforms, especially social media / video platforms don't require full disclosure of use of AI. It might allow a lot of AI slop and misinformation to be eradicated, downvoted, or at least call itself out.

[–] entwine@programming.dev 25 points 19 hours ago (3 children)

I think what's important in this drama is that, despite their evil monopoly shit they're guilty of, Valve really does do the right thing sometimes to win consumers. Gamers want AI disclosures, even if devs don't.

That's why it's not surprising to see that statement from Sweeny, and why it's not surprising that people still hate the Epic Games Store.

[–] Logical@lemmy.world 2 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

Just curious, what is the evil monopoly shit you're referring to? Is it simply the fact they are effectively a monopoly in games distribution, and that in and of itself is bad, or are there more specific practices or actions you're thinking of?

[–] entwine@programming.dev 1 points 3 hours ago

Both. I'm strongly of the opinion that monopolies should not exist, and if they do it's the result of illegal and/or unethical activity, and should be fixed immediately. They break the free market and end up hurting everyone in the long run.

In addition to what @Asterisk@lemmy.world said, they also include a forced arbitration clause in their terms of service to prevent class action lawsuits from customers.

Tbh, they're very low on my personal list of monopolies to hate, so I don't really have that many arguments ready to go. I'm sure others have made a good case against Steam somewhere on the internet already.

[–] ast3risk@lemmy.world 2 points 6 hours ago* (last edited 6 hours ago)

People often point to their 30% cut of all transactions (except for large publishers) and their MFN policies that force devs to price games the same on other stores too.

[–] imetators@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 11 hours ago

To add, I am pretty sure most of devs are actually for AI disclosure. Who really is against are publishers.

[–] pressanykeynow@lemmy.world 6 points 13 hours ago

There's nothing evil in Steam monopoly. Their evil thing is gambling.

[–] MadPsyentist@lemmy.nz 24 points 1 day ago

Agree 100%. It is just Disclosure, if you use AI for voice lines on a robot character but the game is good then disclosing that "this game used ai during creation" isnt a bad thing, you used a tool for a tool to help make your game. I dont think disclosure hurts you.

If your game is a simple asset swap of a unity demo and you used 10 prompts to generate all the story, dialogue and sky boxes then disclousing you used ai is simple a branding iron on a pile of shit. The branding iron aint changing the smell of your pile.

There is a lot of inbetween these 2 extreams, but the consumer havung more information in the buying process is not a bad thing.

[–] rumba@lemmy.zip 4 points 18 hours ago

We need the disclosures now to slow the pace of the bullshit taking over, but it will not be stopped.

I mean, fuck, at this point if they're using photoshop to extend a background, it's AI. It'll just end up becoming the California this contains items known to cause cancer logo all over again. It's still the right thing to call it out, but everything, in short order, will require the label.

So why the fuck are they fighting to not do it? I'll be a couple of billable hours and everyone and their brother will either disclose that they're doing it or lie about it and we can move on with life.

[–] panda_abyss@lemmy.ca 24 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Disclosure is good, but it would be useful to be granular and clear.

Games could use ai for interactive dialogue or content generation and it would be really cool.

Games could run models like olmo 3 which are completely open source, and that wouldn’t be bad in my opinion.

Ai textures probably make sense too depending on context.

[–] olympicyes@lemmy.world 9 points 1 day ago

It would be funny if a game used the base tier OpenAI api and your wizard started slipping some ads into his dialogue.

[–] lemmeLurk@lemmy.zip 8 points 1 day ago (9 children)

It's like hard to draw a line as well. If I take a picture with my phone today of the city I live in and use it in a game, the phone applies some AI filters automatically.

[–] dragonfly4933@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 23 hours ago (1 children)

I think different people have different aversions to why they don't like or want to use AI.

In the case of "automatic" "filters" on pictures taken on phones, this is or was called computational photography. Over time more capabilities were added to these systems until we now have the moon situation and the latest NN processing.

If someone only cares about environmental impact, then that doesn't really apply in this case if the processing happens on device, since by definition a phone is low power and thus doesn't consume water for cooling or much power for compute.

However, some people care about copying, for numerous and possibly conflicting reasons. Generating assets might violate their sense that IP was stolen, since it's a pretty well known fact that that these models were created in large part with dubiously licensed or entirely unlicensed works. I think a reasonable argument can be made that the algorithms that make LLMs work parallels compression. But whatever the case, the legality doesn't matter for most people's feelings.

Others don't like that assets are generated by compute at all. Maybe for economic or political reasons. Some might feel that a social contract has been violated. For example, it used to be the case that on large social media, you had some kind of "buy in" from society. The content might have been low quality or useless drivel, but there was a relativly high cost to producing lots of content, and the owners of the site didn't have direct or complete control of the platform.

Now a single person or company can create a social media site, complete with generated content and generated users, and sucker clueless users into thinking it's real. It was a problem before, various people getting sucked into an echo chamber of their peers, now it is likely to happen that there will be another set of users get sucked into an entirely generated echo chamber.

We can see this happening now. Companies like openai are creating social media sites ("apps" as they call them now) filled only with slop. There are even companies that make apps for romance and dating virtual or fake partners.

Generated content is also undesirable for some users because maybe they want to see the output of a person. There is already plenty of factory bullshit on the various app stores, why do they need or want the output of a machine when there is already existing predatory content out there they could have now.

Some people are starting to wake up to the fact that they have only a single life. Chasing money doesn't do it for most. Some find religion, others want to achieve and see others achieve. Generating content isn't an achievement of the person initiating the generation. They didn't suffer to make it. A person slaves away in art school for years only to take a shit job they looked up to for years, then doing the best work they can under crazy pressure is an achievement.

[–] lemmeLurk@lemmy.zip 1 points 13 hours ago

Jean completely agree, but for me that just underlined the point above of making it more granular. But there will be almost no big games where you can say truly nothing was done by the AI.

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[–] finalarbiter@lemmy.dbzer0.com 321 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (23 children)

I love how Valve's strategy is basically just 'don't piss off the customers and occasionally do something super fucking cool', while everyone else in the space seems to be cutting off their nose to spite their face

[–] brachiosaurus@mander.xyz 1 points 7 hours ago

I don't love much how people fall from valve marketing. Not owning any game i buy would piss me off

[–] Goodlucksil@lemmy.dbzer0.com 153 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Benefits of not beinp publicly traded.

[–] brachiosaurus@mander.xyz 1 points 7 hours ago

Valve ceo just added a $500 million mega yacht to his fleet. Valve true benefit is that thanks to window they managed to build a monopoly on videogames distribuition and that their customers are kids addicted to videogames.

[–] IzzyJ@lemmy.world 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)
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[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world 134 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (11 children)

Epic Games CEO and Fortnite boss Tim Sweeney:

everyone will have to 'fess up to using it eventually as AI will become "involved in nearly all future production."

Once again Epic games act like the moronic villains they are.

[–] Resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 19 hours ago

As an engineer, tell that to my seat-flattened ass Tim Apple.

Companies that use AI in production are sewing the seeds of their own demise.

[–] vacuumflower@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Why do they say these stupid things as if they were giving an order?

They can't order people to buy their stuff, they can't order their stuff to work when it doesn't. Having "AI" in it doesn't change the latter part in case they think otherwise, just got this idea.

I suppose they like the change from the old "spend lots of resources, then scale indefinitely" with software development to the more traditional in other spheres "spend constant amount of resources for constant result", and expect it will build hierarchies like everywhere.

Well, companies were going bankrupt long before personal computing.

I don't know about Epic Games, I think I'll play Oolite in free time when I'm done with my EU4 addiction. Or actually make something useful.

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[–] BlackLaZoR@fedia.io 5 points 1 day ago (1 children)

All the nuance is lost in these discussions. It's something else when you're pushing slop made 100% with AI, and something else if you're using AI for mundane stuff like secondary voice lines in ARC Raiders for example

[–] aesthelete@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago (2 children)

So, then you are in favor of the disclosures?

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[–] root@lemmy.world 58 points 1 day ago
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