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Notably absent from Walz’s speech was any real substance on foreign policy — including discussion of the genocide happening against Palestinians in Gaza, which uncommitted delegates and their allies have been trying to discuss for days at DNC. Indeed, most of the night, if not the week, has ignored the issue, and where it has been mentioned, Israel’s role in the genocide has been glossed over.

Uncommitted delegates in support of Palestinian liberation and an end to the genocide have requested that the DNC allow a Palestinian speaker take the podium in the United Center, to discuss a permanent ceasefire and an embargo for weapons from the U.S. to Israel, which the U.S. is legally obligated to do.

“We are learning that Israeli hostages’ families will be speaking from the main stage. We strongly support that decision and also strongly hope that we will also be hearing from Palestinians who’ve endured the largest civilian death toll since 1948,” read a statement from the Uncommitted National Movement account on X. "Excluding a Palestinian speaker betrays the party’s commitment in our platform to valuing Israelis and Palestinian lives equally. Vice President Harris must unite this party with a vision that fights for everyone, including Palestinians."

A group of uncommitted delegates, joined by interfaith leaders and their allies, staged a sit-in just outside the convention hall on Wednesday night, saying they wouldn’t remove themselves from that spot until their demands for a Palestinian speaker were met.

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[–] Keeponstalin@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

No one is demanding it be the main discussion. Of course topics like women's rights and inflation are going to get the most time as they are high priority for most voters. But that's not the same as it getting no discussion. The DNC is giving time for families of Israeli hostages to speak, which is great, but are also denying anyone to speak on behalf of the Palestinian victims. Which is showing that the DNC does not consider the victims or their voices to be equal.

While low on the importance for most voters, as foreign policy usually is, the vast majority are still in support of a permanent ceasefire. However, for hundreds of thousands of Democratic voters in critical swing states, it is a major issue. Also for over 200 delegates. Those votes and delegates are critical for securing the election.

The anti-genocide protests will only gain more momentum, it's a dangerous situation for the Democratic party to continue ignoring them

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

A Gaza ceasefire did get some discussion. Sanders and AOC, both high profile speakers, promoted a Gaza ceasefire in their speeches. But Americans aren't interested enough in Gaza to justify a speaker who will mainly or exclusively be discussing that topic.

And yes, Americans are more interested in rescuing hostages than helping war victims. Not just in the abstract, polling consistently shows that Americans overwhelmingly view Hamas as evil but are more evenly divided regarding Netanyahu. It might seem unfair, but don't blame the DNC. That's our national mood, which the DNC will respond to. If Gaza activists want that to change then they will have to do more work.

[–] SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

If Gaza activists want that to change then they will have to do more work.

So easy when our government keeps using our taxpayer dollars to prop up Israel and it's swarm of bots to shut down any dissenting voices online. I guess the activists just need to get more money somehow to battle the endless propaganda from Israel that is literally funded by our taxpayer dollars.

Yeah, they've got their work cut out for them when they're basically going against US/Israeli imperialist propaganda with basically an endless supply of money to finance it.

Yup, they just need to try harder, that's the ticket. This is the most out of touch bullshit I've ever fucking had the displeasure to read.

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 5 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Who said change is easy? Those who challenge entrenched interests will always have a difficult road ahead.

But it's not impossible. Civil rights activists achieved change, LGBTQ activists achieved change, even wack-job anti-abortion activists achieved change. So can Gaza activists.

[–] SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone -2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

The calculus has changed. Those things happened before concerted propaganda via the internet, which is largely unregulated, unlike television and newspapers. Previously, spreading propaganda was a lot more difficult. The reality is that propaganda is disseminated at high speeds and has tools like Persona Management Software, where half the people you are arguing with online, aren't even real people (just hundreds of sockpuppet accounts controlled by a single person). Was anyone ever able to "flood the zone" with bogus material like this in the past? No, because only the internet allows such endless publishing with no guardrails.

But sure, somehow those are all exactly the same. It's not like LGBTQ rights have been losing ground or anything recently? Give me a break.

We literally have an anti-trans billionaire who owns a fucking media organization, and because he's insulated by money, fuck-all happens to him when he breaks the law.

EDIT: Further, we're literally headlong into a "death of truth" era because of AI video. The idea that the speed at which propaganda can be made and disseminated doesn't change how hard it is to fight is abso-fucking-lutely bullshit. This is a way harder fight, and comparing to past fights is a fucking joke.

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

All activists will sometimes lose ground. The successful ones gain the ground back. The unsuccessful ones are discouraged by setbacks, complain about the latest tactics used by their opponents, and give up.

Women's rights activists suffered a huge setback in 2022. They did more than complain about the internet and billionaires. They redoubled their efforts and are determined to gain all that ground back in the coming years. And then some.

[–] Keeponstalin@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

A genocide can't really wait years for action

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 0 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Well, in America change generally takes years. Activism takes patience. Set your goals accordingly.

[–] Keeponstalin@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

The goal is a ceasefire. When we are arming one side, Israel, that uses our weapons to eradicate the other side, Palestinians; a ceasefire means to stop providing the weapons used for genocide. Conditional military aid, conditional on Israel abiding by international laws and not committing war crimes and crimes against humanity.

That is the moral position. That is also popular, and a great way for Harris to gain support and momentum. In general but also critically in key states.

An April 2024 poll of likely voters across the U.S. found that 30% strongly supported withholding military funds to Israel until the attacks on Gaza stop; another 25% somewhat supported that conditional aid policy.

If you see Palestinians as equals, I don't get why you're arguing against the people advocating for their voice instead of being an advocate

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

If the goal is a ceasefire, commonly defined as a bilateral end of hostilities, then you should encourage and reward the administration's attempts to secure a ceasefire.

If the goal is to stop arming Israel, then Americans overall do not sufficiently support this goal right now. That means this goal will take years to achieve.

If you want to help Palestinians, then you should be realistic about what you can achieve and how long it will take.

[–] Keeponstalin@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

40-100 thousand people have died while they fail to pressure Israel to agree to the ceasefire. Americans overall do, you don't.

First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom

  • MLK Jr
[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Let us realize the arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice

MLK had patience, which that quote exemplifies. It took the civil rights movement years to see any results.

[–] SulaymanF@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

MLK hated people like you who told him to be patient, that he was too radical and that he was trying to change America too quickly or that his protests were hurting LBJ’s re-election campaign. He wrote long diatribes against this idea and people who told him he was moving too fast, go read his anger in Letters from a Birmingham Jail.

Don’t misquote him like that.

Edit: Why We Can’t Wait was the actual title of his 1964 book. King’s “Letter” issues a call for urgency. He wrote it as a response to eight local white clergymen who had criticized his activities in Birmingham and appealed for a more patient and restrained approach to lobbying for civil rights. The “Letter” expresses King’s deep disappointment with “the white moderate,” who “paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom.” https://sojo.net/articles/when-patience-becomes-complacency-why-we-cant-wait

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Whether he liked it or not, it took years for the civil rights movement to see any results. The same is true of every other successful activist movement.

[–] SulaymanF@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

We’ve already been waiting years. Stop being so condescending. If you’re actually on our side like you claim, you could show empathy rather than telling us grieving people that we’re not being patient enough. Again, MLK hated people who said that to his coalition. Have you read his stuff yet?

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Empathy for American activists doesn't help Palestinians. If anything, American activists are often counterproductive. Telling the DNC to fuck off doesn't bring your goals any closer to reality.

And you don't speak for MLK.

[–] SulaymanF@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Nice strawman. I think we’re done here if you can’t even be honest.

Edit: April 16, 1963, King wrote his most famous “Letters from a Birmingham jail” in response to eight local white clergymen who had criticized his activities in Birmingham and appealed for a more patient and restrained approach to lobbying for civil rights. The “Letter” expresses King’s deep disappointment with “the white moderate,” who “paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man’s freedom.”

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago (1 children)

The strawman is that activists should be more "restrained". I never said that.

You can be as fervent as you want. It will still take years to get results. So buckle up.

And if you don't want to make friends with politicians then it will take even longer. MLK at least didn't burn his bridges in Congress.

[–] SulaymanF@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

MLK publicly fought with LBJ over his watering down of the Civil Rights Act. LBJ supporters accused him of Potentially derailing his election the same way Democrats today accused Palestine protesters of derailing Biden. History isn’t as rosy as you pretend it is, learn your history since MLK publicly castigated those “allies” in his famous Letter, historically burning those bridges that you claim we need to build.

I’m not going to keep repeating myself since you refuse to even look at what’s historical record and have you keep abusing MLK’s name to fit your ahistorical claims just like Republicans do. This goes far beyond MLK, as far back as the Abolitionist movement which also didn’t try making friends and compromises in the face of moral depravity.

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

I knew that you had just that great spirit and you know you have our support and backing…I think one of the great tributes that we can pay in memory of President Kennedy is to try to enact some of the great, progressive policies that he sought to initiate.

This is how a successful activist operates. Not "fuck the racist White House that has failed to pass the civil rights act".

[–] SulaymanF@lemmy.world 1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Oh look you finally started to read what MLK said, how many times did I ask? But you conveniently ignored the one source I kept pointing to and cited something unrelated. Darn these facts getting in the way of your opinion, amirite?

This may blow your mind but MLK said both things at different times. Both to pressure LBJ and try to drive public opinion. One didn’t invalidate the other. You’re intentionally missing my point. I’m done.

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world -1 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

He said the right thing at the right time. And when he wanted LBJs support, he said he supported LBJ.

You seem to think MLK never spoke again after writing the letter you cite over and over.

Do you even know who MLK openly supported in the 1964 election?

[–] ChronosTriggerWarning@lemmy.world -2 points 2 months ago

I just wanna say i like your style. You're saying a lot of the things that I've been trying to say, but you're way more eloquent than I.

[–] SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Oh no! Someone complained! That must mean they're not a real activist who gets anything done and thus should be chided and dismissed!

If that's really your implication here, get fucked, cunt. People can and do both. You're allowed to speak at how fucked the situation is while also trying to do something about it, and people telling us "just try harder" like they're doing anything better can eat dogshit.

[–] FlowVoid@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

You can, and should, do whatever activism you can.

Who cares about how hard it is with Persona Management blah blah blah. Activism isn't supposed to be easy. Get it done, or don't.

Every other Democratic activist in America faces the exact same problems, but they aren't whining. Women's rights activists got ballot initiatives in ten states this year. They rose to the challenge, and that's why they are successful.