this post was submitted on 14 Sep 2023
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I have a network-wide pi hole and I noticed that it requested activity.windows.com, a url blocked by my pi hole, even while my pc is suspended. I pinged 10.0.0.217 and it is currently unreachable. So, somehow, windows pc’s turn on networking, phones home, and turns off even while suspended.

Creepy behavior

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[–] cooopsspace@infosec.pub 176 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Honestly if you're still trying to find workaround for Microsofts crap at this point - just switch to Linux.

[–] DarkDarkHouse@lemmy.sdf.org 175 points 1 year ago (3 children)

At this point for me, trying to get games working on Linux has become easier than trying to get telemetry to stop working on Windows.

[–] cooopsspace@infosec.pub 36 points 1 year ago (2 children)

And since Ive never bought the problematic games before it's so much easier for me.

I'd encourage anyone to ditch the crappy anticheat broken crap and just go back to playing good high quality games.

[–] ShittyRedditWasBetter@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

🙄 there are plenty of great games with anti cheat.

[–] cooopsspace@infosec.pub 31 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah and they all work on Linux.

The ones that don't can get fucked.

[–] kevinbacon@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago
[–] theangryseal@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

I game on Linux every day.

I wish multiplayer worked across the board but it’s whatever. I don’t have time for it any way haha.

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[–] aldalire@lemmy.dbzer0.com 22 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Oh, my daily driver is a linux, i just have a spare surface book 3 i use occasionally for gaming (the thing is surprisingly powerful)

Idk how well linux would support detaching and touchscreen with pen. But I’ll definitely switch the os to linux sometime in the future when i get a new gaming rig.

[–] cooopsspace@infosec.pub 8 points 1 year ago

I have a convertible laptop with pen and it works fine.

[–] glasgitarrewelt@feddit.de 7 points 1 year ago

I am using linux-surface on my surface book 2, works perfectly. BUT the webcam doesn't work :-)

[–] American_Jesus@lemm.ee 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

In trying it doing that on someone hybrid, not surface but a Lenovo, PopOS! seems to works mostly out-of-box.

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[–] El_Rocha@lm.put.tf 121 points 1 year ago (7 children)

Is this machine by any chance a recent laptop?

Newer laptops with Intel cpu (not sure about AMD) don't have a real sleep mode anymore. Instead, they have a mode where, besides the ram, the cpu and the network device are also kept alive for communication.

In theory, this means that when you wake up your device all of your apps and stuff will already be updated with the latest information from the web with little battery loss. In practice, it just overheats your laptop while in your backpack and kills the battery.

The ping you see while it is "sleeping" might be from this.

[–] LiveLM@lemmy.zip 53 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

It's such a dumb fucking feature too.
"Oh god forbid my email client and messaging app refresh 5 seconds after I wake my laptop instead of being already refreshed"
Who actually cares? Who on earth asked for this zombie sleep state?

[–] El_Rocha@lm.put.tf 5 points 1 year ago

I think the worst part is not that they added it, but that they removed regular S3.

Don't forget the added feature of your laptop overheating and crashing when you put it into your backpack.

Or my personal favorite is when it doesn't overheat and crash it drains 20% of it's battery in 15 minutes then goes into hibernation.

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[–] Redex68@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago

Linus explored that bug, it's not so much with recent laptops as it is with Windows sleep in general. For some god forsaken reason, if your laptop is connected to a network while plugged in and you put it to sleep, and then unplug your laptop from the power, it will burn through its battery and die. This doesn't happen if you unplug your laptop before you put it into sleep mode. My guess is that while it's plugged in, Windows thinks it's fine for it to run a bit hotter, but when you unplug it while it's in sleep mode, it doesn't realise it's not plugged in anymore and drains the battery. Idk how they have still not fixed this after many years, but it is still a problem.

[–] user224@lemmy.sdf.org 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

As the time goes I just miss my old laptop more and more. What's next, no shutdown feature?

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[–] Dreadful6644@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

Same for most AMD laptops as well.

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[–] sp00nix@lemmy.ml 42 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Sleep is no longer what it used to be. They killed off S3 sleep in favor of some always connected mode, much like you cell phone.

[–] DarkThoughts@kbin.social 7 points 1 year ago

Which has its pros and cons, but that still doesn't mean it should invade your privacy.

[–] 9488fcea02a9@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 year ago

I only learned this during the pandemic when i started working from home and my work laptop would wake up at 1am, fans blasting 100%

Or my laptop would wake up in my backpack during my commute and drain the whole battery...

I opened a helpdesk ticket and they didnt know why. Their solution was "just turn off your laptop"....

After doing my owm digging, i realized S3 was gone and windows just does whatever the fuck it wants

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[–] FeelzGoodMan420@eviltoast.org 28 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Oh god another one of these posts...

When pihole blocks a dns request, devices often keep trying to connect until the connection is successful. So yea, no shit it's ginna keep trying to query that domain repeatedly, including when you're sleeping.

[–] aldalire@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 year ago (3 children)

The thing is, the device was in suspend for a couple days now.

[–] Strykker@programming.dev 20 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Modern sleep modes are internet connected, with the intent to allow systems to perform updates while sleeping.

I don't like it but that's how it's designed to work.

[–] vox@sopuli.xyz 9 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

aka S0 sleep/Modern Standby.
It has some legitimate benefits like returning from sleep immediately. Kinda want it on linux but without all the telemetry crap (but it's really, really hard to pull of at an OS level)

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[–] selokichtli@lemmy.ml 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

So, let me grasp your comment, are you saying that this is not creepy at all?

EDIT: To clarify, I find both things creepy, the telemetry and the insistence to ping home no matter what.

[–] FeelzGoodMan420@eviltoast.org 13 points 1 year ago

The fact that windows has so much telemetry is creepy yes. The fact that it will keep trying to ping the domain when blocked is not creepy and is basic tech functionality.

[–] otl@lemmy.sdf.org 10 points 1 year ago (3 children)

are you saying that this is not creepy at all?

Definitely creepy that it phones home in the first place.

But it's not necessarily creepy that it keeps trying; it could just be sloppy programming. Hanlon's Razor comes to mind. Microsoft Teams behaved in a similar way apparently. If you blocked it phoning home at the network level it would buffer gigabytes of data on disk until the disk was full.

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[–] Zeppo@sh.itjust.works 19 points 1 year ago (3 children)

My Windows 10 machine comes up from sleep when nobody is anywhere near it. Seems weird to me. Also sometimes I wake it, sign in and the folder Music>Pictures (the regular Pictures folder… for some reason that’s where it is) is open in explorer. Couldn’t figure out whether it’s malware or Microsoft.

[–] glimse@lemmy.world 16 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Go to your NIC's properties and scroll down to disable WAKE ON MAGIC PACKETS.

If you have any device that scans for your MAC (probably your router) it will wake up. Drove me crazy until I figured it out

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[–] TheTetrapod@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago

Yeah, that sounds like ghosts.

[–] Dawn@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I had something similar a while back, where it was waking up from sleep for no reason. I can't remember the exact reason, but it had to do with a hardware being allowed to wake the device. I disabled it from being able to wake the machine and haven't had a problem again. You can use the cmd to find which device woke your pc.

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[–] SexualPolytope@lemmy.sdf.org 19 points 1 year ago

Come on man, he probably just misses his mom.

[–] crispy_kilt@feddit.de 18 points 1 year ago (1 children)
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[–] FuckyWucky@hexbear.net 16 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

switch to enterprise if you havent already. enterprise is the only version from "0" data collection mode in Group Policy.

use this for activation: https://github.com/massgravel/Microsoft-Activation-Scripts

[–] BurnedDonutHole@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 year ago (3 children)

How trustable is this script?

[–] FuckyWucky@hexbear.net 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

its the most recommended one on r/piracy and FMHY.

Here's another one, its created by a mydigitallife forum member https://github.com/abbodi1406/KMS_VL_ALL_AIO

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[–] Syrup@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago

Windows... With this only word you already have all the abswers

[–] Flyberius@hexbear.net 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah. It's amazing how my windows laptop, whilst sleeping, whirrs all its fans up on the middle of the night. I am not suggesting that is it sending out telemetry, but it is fucking infuriating for sleep to mean anything other than "stop doing anything until I tell you to wake up".

[–] Tibert@compuverse.uk 11 points 1 year ago

That is because recent laptops don't "sleep" like before with s4 (hybernate) or other sx.

They have some sort of tucking clock waiting for windows to wake up to check for updates.

In theory it allows to keep everything up to date while people are not working.

However un proactice, it drains battery and overheats laptops, because Microsoft implemented that feature like crap, or the partners did some stupid things.

It was supposed to only activate when the laptop was plugged in. However if the laptop was plugged in, put on sleep, then unplugged, windows still believed that the laptop was plugged in.

Now I don't know if windows ever solved that issue after people brought it up and Linus from Linus tech tips complained to Microsoft.

[–] memphis@sopuli.xyz 12 points 1 year ago
[–] DacoTaco@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Thanks pihole!

(Also, hibernate > sleep imo )

[–] TWeaK@lemm.ee 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Shutdown is hybrid sleep anyway. Best of both worlds.

Also FYI you have to restart to properly shut down Windows now. If you shut down and then turn it back on it will just resume from S4 hybrid sleep. Shut down does not normally shut down, it enters a zero power sleep state. Restart actually shuts down and reboots the OS.

I think hybernation is really meant for when you want near zero power but a little trickle for something specific to wake the PC, eg an external device or network port. You can also sometimes do this directly in BIOS, if it has the facility.

[–] icedterminal@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You're a bit confused.

  • Sleep keeps the system on but in a low power state. User and kernel sessions are kept in RAM. If power is lost, you start from a clean session. The system can resume full power with a key press or mouse movement.
  • Hibernate dumps the user and kernel session from RAM to disk and completely powers off. Upon startup, the hiberfil.sys file is read and put back into RAM. The physical power button must be pressed to turn on.
  • Hybrid Shutdown uses a feature called Fast Startup. The user session is discarded, while the kernel session is written to disk before the system completely powers off. Upon startup, the hiberfil.sys file is read and puts the kernel session back into RAM. The last logged on user has their profile preloaded, including any apps that support the feature. The physical power button must be pressed to turn on.

You can disable Fast Startup or simply hold SHIFT and click Shutdown. The feature requires the user to press the Shutdown button within Windows for it to function. If you press the physical power button on your case, that is an ACPI initiated shutdown and bypasses the Fast Startup feature. This is by design.

Your motherboard firmware controls whether or not the USB ports will continue to supply power when the system is off. It's essentially like a wall brick at this point.

Fast Startup was really meant for HDD. With SSD it's not really necessary. It's negligible time savings and with how buggy drivers can be, days or weeks old kernel sessions are bound to start causing problems.

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[–] umami_wasbi@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Ain't 10.0.0.217 an private IP?

[–] teegus@sh.itjust.works 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yes that is the local ip of the pc phoning home

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[–] jcg@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Probably the IP of the device, not the IP resolved through DNS

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