this post was submitted on 18 Oct 2024
503 points (96.1% liked)

Piracy: ꜱᴀɪʟ ᴛʜᴇ ʜɪɢʜ ꜱᴇᴀꜱ

54247 readers
1006 users here now

⚓ Dedicated to the discussion of digital piracy, including ethical problems and legal advancements.

Rules • Full Version

1. Posts must be related to the discussion of digital piracy

2. Don't request invites, trade, sell, or self-promote

3. Don't request or link to specific pirated titles, including DMs

4. Don't submit low-quality posts, be entitled, or harass others



Loot, Pillage, & Plunder


💰 Please help cover server costs.

Ko-FiLiberapay


founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] Petter1@lemm.ee 3 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)
[–] mizuki@lemmy.blahaj.zone 34 points 3 hours ago (4 children)

as a high schooler with a special interest in computers, it's genuinely surprising how poor most of my peers computers skills are. most of my peers don't even know the very basics of folder structures.

also unrelated, let's all love lain

[–] bane_killgrind@slrpnk.net 1 points 6 minutes ago

Twenty years ago when I was 13, I started doing web stuff. This was back when everything was super simple, so everything to get a webserver up was super manual. I'll mention port forwarding at my current job and there's this slice of people that are 28-40 years old that know what I'm talking about.

[–] breakcore@discuss.tchncs.de 13 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

special interest

poor skill of peers

(I'm totally with you though)

[–] Petter1@lemm.ee 2 points 1 hour ago

I just watched lain some weeks ago without knowing what I have let me into 😂 got pretty confused, but I think in the end I got it. Probably..

[–] BallsandBayonets@lemmings.world 8 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

I blame google for the demise of well-organized folders. Their approach to email was "chuck it all in one big folder named Archive, and you can search for it using keywords that you will definitely remember when you need to find it again!"

It's a useful tool, but paved the way for the current state of affairs where people get overwhelmed by their email because they have 150,000 unread emails in their inbox and as a result, don't read an email until you tell them the entire contents of their email via the inferior messaging platform known as texting.

[–] averyminya@beehaw.org 10 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Idk. I blame Apple, and Android hasn't done much to really bolster the need for file folders (not a bad thing, just lack of opportunity for learning).

But Apple actively prohibits its user base from engaging with folders, and has been for well over a decade - plenty long enough for my (millennial) generation to phase it out and for the generations after to never need them in the first place. Plus, emails aren't dependent on file paths, whereas systems file paths are completely necessary.

[–] tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip 2 points 52 minutes ago (1 children)

Wait, with no folders how does apple deal with files these days? I'm a lifelong pc person so I have no idea

[–] Corr@lemm.ee 1 points 31 minutes ago

As a user you can't access the filesystem. It's completely abstracted away. At least this was the case for the iPhone 6

[–] incognito08@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Without seeds, torrents become almost useless, and many pirate sites offer rare and hard-to-find movies/animes whose torrent versions never download because their seeds are practically extinct forever. So I don't think this is a weak complaint. If torrents didn't have this weakness I would always choose to use them but...

[–] Petter1@lemm.ee 3 points 1 hour ago

The usenet has many treasures

[–] Auli@lemmy.ca 33 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

It’s like cars. Almost everyone has one and can drive it but don’t know how it works. Computers have become that. There are some who know or have an idea of how it works and others who can use it but have no idea.

[–] tetris11@lemmy.ml 6 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Yeah but cars have become increasingly more complex over the last 20 years. You basically need an EEPROM arduino kit these days just to get the fucking diagnostics out of the car, because someone decided that analog circuits were just too much bulk

[–] SoleInvictus@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago) (1 children)

I think their metaphor is referring to ease of use and the knowledge required for use. I have a few personal anecdotes as examples.

I'm an eighties kid. My first PC was a Commodore 64 and my first car was a 1966 VW Bug. Neither was reliable nor easy to use. I had to learn to utilize interfaces that were more finicky and complex than modern equivalents, and I spent a great deal of time learning how to make them work when they glitched out or were broken. The alternative was not having them at all. It was hard to get BBS advice when your PC took a dump and no one else you knew had one you could use, and then where would you get car advice? Certainly not from my dad!

A kid growing up with an Apple anything and driving a 20 year old car doesn't face the same kinds of difficulties. Many things just work more reliably and aren't as difficult to use. One can easily buy gaming systems now where we often had to build our own to get what we wanted. My buddy's 23 year old daughter had never even heard of CLI. That's all I had!

It doesn't make one generation better than the other - younger people today are skilled in ways I could have only dreamed of. We just have different opportunities for excellence.

[–] sqgl@beehaw.org 1 points 31 minutes ago

younger people today are skilled in ways could have only dreamed of.

Any examples?

[–] potemkinhr@lemmy.ml 14 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

If you had real shitty internet back in the day (read 56k modem) and you liked to play russian roulette you would dump satellite traffic with a skystar2 DVB-S card. You never knew what you'd get realistically, found some true gems underneath mountains of coal in the day of (still) unfiltered internet.

[–] Enkers@sh.itjust.works 5 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

That's wild. Did you need a special program to parse stuff out of the data stream? I guess it would mostly come in as http reaponses, so it wouldn't be too hard, but still an interesting problem.

[–] potemkinhr@lemmy.ml 8 points 4 hours ago

Yep, used Skygrabber, you could filter out files depending on extensions, filenames etc and could narrow out what you wanted. Still had no real way of knowing what you'd end up with as you were effectively just passively listening on the satellite traffic. It was wild as you could fill out a 40 gig drive overnight without issues in the era where people were downloading a MP3 album for hours.

[–] collapse_already@lemmy.ml 39 points 6 hours ago (4 children)

I can't even tell you what us Gen Xers did because I am not sure if the statutes of limitations have run.

Vaguely, it involved ftp and file repositories hosted unwittingly by large companies plus restricted IRC channels to discuss the locations of such places.

Unless you killed somebody, the statutes of limitations have run.

I still remember the "dumb" tech was AOL warez chatrooms where you interacted with a chat bot to get an email with lists of scene games, movies and other stuff in the traditional multi-RAR parts, and you'd individually request them a few at a time to be emailed. Then you'd move to IRC when you found out could be done faster, or BBSes.

I've probably forgotten most of how things worked.

[–] a1studmuffin@aussie.zone 7 points 3 hours ago

I remember installing a keylogger on the school library computers, then "accidentally" disconnecting the dialup internet and asking the teacher to type the login credentials again. I bet the ISP was confused when they saw so many concurrent logins after hours, all playing Quake and downloading huge files.

[–] BallsandBayonets@lemmings.world 3 points 3 hours ago

I miss my college days, Terabytes upon terabytes of "Linux ISOs" accessible via the blazing fast internal university network. And the IRC channel, where I learned what trolling was, but never learned to not feed the trolls.

[–] bortsampson@hexbear.net 1 points 2 hours ago

I can't even tell you what us Gen Xers did

They watched tv and traded tapes.

[–] SplashJackson@lemmy.ca 3 points 3 hours ago

Yo Gundam Wing was sick, sweet music

[–] came_apart_at_Kmart@hexbear.net 19 points 6 hours ago (5 children)

the only people who know how to torrent are the ones that want to learn. the learning curve is gentler than a walk-in shower. I've shown people of all ages and all tech backgrounds, though recommending VPN connections and getting that going does throw a few.

anyway, it's so easy, it's crazy compared to the old days of usenet, ZIP disks, ftp sites, .is files, and sequenced RAR files. this is the golden age of piracy and I love it.

[–] bortsampson@hexbear.net 2 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

The tools were annoying but the process wasn't very hard. Unprotected FTPs were pretty common early on and IRC download bots were around before torrenting. Sharing applications like Kazaa, Scour, Limewire, and Napster were super simple. There were fewer roadblocks. I wouldn't want to explain to someone how to get a private invite, understand the trackers rules, and ensure they do not get VPN leaks.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] Pyflixia@kbin.melroy.org 48 points 7 hours ago (4 children)

No.

I've pointed this out on another account on this very community through KBin Social.

And I was talking about how lazy and entitled pirates across all ages have become overtime. That we were losing more and more sources that had withstood a long standing of time. And one moment everyone is going "RAH RAH! HYDRA! CUT ONE DOWN AND MORE COME UP!" but when we lose some of which that have yet to return or take it's place, the attitude grows weak. Almost desperate.

And it's due in part how most of the pirates just take and take, but never give back. On r/piracy and sometimes on here, people are making posts wondering where they can get free stuff and how they can get free stuff. They don't care about the technicalities, they don't care about the cause of piracy, they don't care at all. It's always "give me free shit, thanks, bye". There are few pirates out there doing the work and it's just so that these lazy and entitled pirates can just take and take.

But when we lose sources, they scatter away like cockroaches and all that they can think about is asking where it is that they can get free shit. It's almost like consumerism but for free shit, it's annoyingly disturbing. It's not about wanting the new product, it's about wanting the source to mooch off from.

I sadly predict in time that the whole hydra ideology will just simply become the way the Pirate Bay has become, just a symbol, but will it mean anything? It'll be so if this whole trend continues and all generations are just as guilty to doing it.

[–] tenchiken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 17 points 5 hours ago

The best pirates are librarians with legit ethics.

Preserve human knowledge and make it available to everyone.

I hate that you are right about mostly just greedy dipshits pissing in the high seas without contributing.

We should have taken up arms after Aaron Swartz...

[–] christian@lemmy.ml 15 points 5 hours ago

I agree with the sentiment that it's very easy to underestimate the harm done by the loss of a major site or scene group, but I'm not sure I really agree with much else you've written here. In particular:

And it’s due in part how most of the pirates just take and take, but never give back. On r/piracy and sometimes on here, people are making posts wondering where they can get free stuff and how they can get free stuff. They don’t care about the technicalities, they don’t care about the cause of piracy, they don’t care at all. It’s always “give me free shit, thanks, bye”.

The people making those posts have minimal exposure to piracy. This is getting your feet wet. For me, contributing my share is saying that I think these users deserve access. Yeah, they wouldn't have a place on a private tracker, that's not a problem because they're not on a private tracker, and if they join one they won't stay for long if they neglect seeding.

I'm sure a lot of these people will continue their lives without seeding or contributing. I won't say I endorse that, but I'm cool with it, and even if I wasn't I still don't think an argument can made that the harms of any hypothetical injustice here outweigh the benefits from a single dedicated pirate that began their journey this way.

I care about uploader counts, about seeder counts, about the wellbeing of the people who maintain the infrastructure. I'm invested. I don't care about download counts. Looking at an unseeded download as a loss in seeder count makes exactly the same amount of sense to me as looking at a download as a lost sale. I think it's morally right to support pirates who will not end up contributing, and beyond that I think treating them with kindness a net plus for the cause, because less than 100% of them will just say “give me free shit, thanks, bye”.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] magic_smoke@links.hackliberty.org 37 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago) (5 children)

No most millennials are also too lazy because they stopped giving a shit about computers when it stopped being a requirement to use the internet like 10-15 years ago because smartphones.

Most who did haven't in at least a decade, and wouldn't unless you put a gun to their head.

For some reason the vast majority of people seem to just want to ignore the machines that literally run our society, and its fucking maddening.

FFS the amount of people who I work with in IT and even then don't really give a shit about they're daily computing is absolutely fucking baffling.

Its really just a smattering of people from all ages who actually know how to use a computer because they're actually interested in doing so.

load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments
view more: next ›