I would just like consistency that's it, I hate that some players are rewarded for falling down while other are basically penalized just because they are considered strong
this post was submitted on 22 Nov 2023
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No. It makes playing good defense virtually impossible.
After watching Giannis literally dip his shoulder and go right into the chest of everyone on the Suns during his championship run, I'm gonna say no. That was tough to watch as a Suns fan. They literally couldn't do anything without being called for a foul
Put me down as a ‘nay’. Also, the NBA is totally tilted in favor of offense in every way anyway.
It's gotten ridiculous. A defender can't even be in a legal guarding position while moving anymore, not initiating any contact nor jumping in front of offensive player, and the offensive player is allowed to throw their shoulder into you. I can't watch that garbage.
Not only should the drive-into-a-defender not be rewarded, I am tired of an offensive player that is bigger/stronger backing down a player in the post. You work for position. Pushing someone off the block with your back/ass should be a foul. You are entitled to your position.
Don’t get me wrong. Turning and working around a player with some force is not that same thing, but usually done right at the basket. You need to establish that position before getting the ball, not get the ball 8-10 feet out and push the defender all the way under the basket.
no i dont like watching the 76ers
Decades ago I felt it was more balanced. The guys could really play physical with one another. Now it is tilted way too far in favor of the offence. You watch a guy like Giannis who is a bull in a china shop or Embiid lowering their shoulder to dislodge an opponent, then those same defenders being called for a trash ass foul like a hand on the hip or the player jumping through them. It is infuriating. It is also not consistent in the calls either.
I think any contact that gains an advantage should be considered a foul. Post player backing down his defender? FOUL.
Only for my team
lol, a bunch of babies in this thread. I think there should be less no calls in general
Adapt the FIBA rules.
I think when a player is airborne clearly going to the hoop and they collide with a player most of the time its fine to reward the offensive player. (Giannis can sometimes be a bit much bulldozing someone)
The thing I hate is the little arm kick-out to slightly elbow the defender who is side-to-side with you on your way up and its an And-1. You see it a lot with elite guards like Dame, Kyrie, Steph, Mitchell.
Nah it’s gotten insane. SGA got free throws for running in to Wiggins, then kicking him in the balls. Kerr even challenged it and refs decided that Wiggins balls affected the shot so the foul stood.
I know NBA management just wants more scoring because they think it’s better for ratings. Just annoying to see dudes throw themselves at defenders constantly and get rewarded for it.
I like tough physical defense.
Let them play
I just don't like how this conversation ignores defensive positioning. People focus on the offensive player initiating contact and never acknowledge how the defensive players are routinely in poor positions that lead to these calls.
Should just be play on it the offensive player clearly initiates contact
No. But that's been the league for too long sadly. I remember when Hibbert popularized the "principal of verticality", but that didn't seem to apply to everyone, and it's certainly not upheld all the time...or most of the time to be honest.
No its gonna be a disaster for the fans sooner or later if the refs dont manage it.
Yesterdays game for exp. where Strus gets a flag foul just for running back and ttrying to stay vertical whiles Maxey with full force dives into him to initiate contact is crazy....
The game is evolving , yes fans want to see offense but at some point its gonna backfire, i dont even blame the players if Embiid or others who make a living through selling contact get rewarded why should they stop.
Hell. No. It should be determined by some simple physics. Whichever player asserts more kinetic energy into the other is the offender.
It is an obvious no the way you have phrased it. Under this interpretation, what is stopping a player from running full speed at the defender and running them over. Games would be over in 10 minutes with everyone fouling out. The most valuable skill in basketball would become leaping out of the way.
I honestly don't care as long it's called the same both ways.
I'm tired of the reffing. Just call consistency
Fuck no, it's dumb as hell.
I don’t like it and I really don’t like how some players get a nicer whistle in those situations than others.
It's stupid that drawing fouls is a thing in the NBA
I honestly don't care as long it's called the same both ways.
Other night Shai initiated contact with Wiggins. And fucking kicked Wiggins in the nuts and there was no offensive foul call. So hell to the nah
It started under Stern, but Silver's time as commissioner really saw the league turn into entertainment that masquerades as a competitive sport. If a decision can be made to make the game more attractive to new viewers, that decision will almost always be taken. Such decisions usually fall on the side of promoting more offense and higher scoring games.
However, if we look back 5 or 10 years , I think the league has actually improved somewhat in not rewarding foul baiters. Especially on the perimeter, we see more instances where the offensive player initiating contact is a) only rewarded with a foul on the floor or b) not given anything.
It's more challenging in the paint, and the league still has work to do there. I'll admit that refs have a tough job. If a tiny guard lowers his shoulder into a sturdy 7 footer to create space for a layup, it's a tough call to make if the guard embellishes the contact while the big man appears to have stood his ground.
What a leading question lol
Not every time but in most cases yes. On the flip side I definitely think most types of push off or moving screens should be penalized.
No. Artificial numbers and stars, lot of guys would suffer without easy ft offense and wouldn't be so many clowns averaging 25ppg.
Also there's no consistency in calls at all. I don't know what I'm watching at times. NBA clearly favors players and teams that make more money. When I watch bad teams play, some of these guys get no fouls called for them.
Fuck no
Foul baiting is the worst thing about basketball. It’s embarrassing watching grown men flail and flop.
How do you know when offense initiates?
If defender is standing still, that's a charge. Beyond that, both players are trying to get to a spot. If offense guy gets there first, defender is late - is that initiation?
For a example player a is on the wing and makes a drive to the basket and player b is side by side with him. If player b is still moving and player a gives him a bump with the shoulder, that shouldn't be an offensive foul since player b the defender is 1) not set 2) not square to the offensive player a. Now if player a and b stop , player a pump fakes ,player b is stationary with his hands up perpendicular and player a jumps into player b then yes that should be an offensive foul.
If you jump into your own space - ie up - that would make sense to be a foul if someone is there and makes foul contact. If you go into someone else's space, that would not be a foul.
It's just rare for all this to happen standing still. People are moving all the time. People are in each other's space.
My take is overall the offense gets more benefit of doubt to ensure clean shooting opportunities nowadays, and the offense took advantage of that bias. 10 years ago, getting clean shooting opportunities was harder and the offense had less incentive to sell it because the foul wouldn't come anyways.