this post was submitted on 07 Dec 2023
134 points (95.9% liked)

Leftism

2452 readers
1 users here now

Our goal is to be the one stop shop for leftism here at lemmy.world! We welcome anyone with beliefs ranging from SocDemocracy to Anarchism to post, discuss, and interact with our community. We are a democratic community, and as such, welcome metaposts that seek to amend the rules through consensus. Post articles, videos, questions, analysis and more. As long as it's leftist, it's welcome here!

Rules:

Posting Expectations:

Sister Communities:

!abolition@slrpnk.net !antiwork@lemmy.world !antitrumpalliance@lemmy.world !breadtube@lemmy.world !climate@slrpnk.net !fuckcars@lemmy.world !iwwunion@lemmy.ml !leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com !leftymusic@lemmy.world !privacy@lemmy.world !socialistra@midwest.social !solarpunk@slrpnk.net Solarpunk memes !therightcantmeme@midwest.social !thepoliceproblem@lemmy.world !vuvuzelaiphone@lemmy.world !workingclasscalendar@lemmy.world !workreform@lemmy.world

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
all 16 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] 800XL@lemmy.world 27 points 2 years ago
[–] someguy3@lemmy.ca 23 points 2 years ago

Everyone remember George Bush saying "if you're not with us, then you're against us"?

[–] themeatbridge@lemmy.world 20 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Zionism is the idea that Israel should exist. Criticizing Israel for committing genocide is not anti-zionist.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@kbin.social 15 points 2 years ago (2 children)

That's also not anti-semitic (it's what the one-state solution is all about), but either way Zionism in the modern day is a more extreme ideology. It's specifically that Israel has a right to at least all of historic Palestine, and that Palestinians should either live under Apartheid or GTFO.

[–] metaStatic@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

how can it possibly get more extreme than "We want to do colonialism too"?

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@kbin.social 8 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

So Israel and Palestinians are supposed to have reached a fucked up compromise of sorts in the Oslo accords that's basically "We return to pre-1967 borders". "Vanilla" Zionists, so to speak, aren't opposed to this in principle, but extreme Zionists (which are running Israel right now) believe that this compromise is wrong and that Jews should colonize and genocide all of historical Palestine. So it's the difference between "we want colonialism" and "we want even more colonialism".

[–] duffman@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

The term Zionism is rather unhelpful at this point. The people with unpopular views use it to hide their true stance.

It's strategic equivocation. When their viewpoint is challenged they just claim they were talking about other definitions of the word.

[–] badbytes@lemmy.world 15 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Assertions without third party consensus is delusional.

[–] rockSlayer@lemmy.world 16 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

it's amazing but not at all surprising how they barrelled towards this vote despite the large population of American Jews that support the liberation of Palestine and specifically point out how positions like this are genuinely antisemitic.

[–] Nougat@kbin.social 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)
[–] rockSlayer@lemmy.world 15 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

yes, I'm aware, and so is Al Jazeera. No one is denying that anti-zionism can and has been used as a mask for antisemitism. But that's not what they're opposing. The vote includes language to classify the DC protesters calling for a ceasefire "rioters".

[–] shrugal@lemm.ee 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Next up: Pi is equal to 3!

[–] lseif@sopuli.xyz 1 points 2 years ago
[–] Varyk@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

See, this is why this word zionism shouldn't be used anymore.

Because israeli supporters say s*** like this, and they mean " Israel deserves to have a country", which yes, most people agree with.

anti-Zionists are specifically opposed to the illegal colonization of Palestine.

And everyone just pretends that the other person is using their subjective definition.

That is very upsetting. Anti-illegal colonization is not anti-Semitism.