this post was submitted on 08 Sep 2023
785 points (95.8% liked)

News

23259 readers
2967 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

Ukrainian presidential adviser says deaths of civilians ‘the price of a cocktail of ignorance and big ego’

A senior Ukrainian official has accused Elon Musk of “committing evil” after a new biography revealed details about how the business magnate ordered his Starlink satellite communications network to be turned off near the Crimean coast last year to hobble a Ukrainian drone attack on Russian warships.

In a statement on X, the social media platform formerly known as Twitter, which Musk owns, the Ukrainian presidential adviser Mykhailo Podolyak wrote that Musk’s interference led to the deaths of civilians, calling them “the price of a cocktail of ignorance and big ego”.

“By not allowing Ukrainian drones to destroy part of the Russian fleet via Starlink interference, @elonmusk allowed this fleet to fire Kalibr missiles at Ukrainian cities. As a result, civilians, and children are being killed,” Podolyak wrote.

“Why do some people so desperately want to defend war criminals and their desire to commit murder? And do they now realise that they are committing evil and encouraging evil?”

Musk defended his decision, saying he did not want his SpaceX company to be “explicitly complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation”.

CNN on Thursday quoted an excerpt from the biography Elon Musk by Walter Isaacson, which described how armed submarine drones were approaching a Russian fleet near the Crimean coast when they “lost connectivity and washed ashore harmlessly”.

The biography, due out on Tuesday, alleges Musk ordered Starlink engineers to turn off the service in the area of the attack because of his concern that Vladimir Putin would respond with nuclear weapons to a Ukrainian attack on Russian-occupied Crimea.

Musk, who is also the CEO of the Tesla electric car company and SpaceX rocket and spacecraft manufacturer, initially agreed to supply Starlink hardware to Ukraine after Russia’s full-scale invasion disrupted Ukrainian communications. But he reportedly had second thoughts after Kyiv succeeded in repelling the initial Russian assault and began to counterattack.

Musk has previously been embroiled in a social media spat with Ukrainian officials including the president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, over his ideas for ending Russia’s invasion.

In October last year, Musk proposed a peace deal involving re-running under UN supervision annexation referendums in Moscow-occupied Ukrainian regions, acknowledging Russian sovereignty over the Crimean peninsula and giving Ukraine a neutral status.

“Preliminary analysis suggests that the reach and influence of Kremlin-backed accounts has grown further in the first half of 2023, driven in particular by the dismantling of Twitter’s safety standards.

The EU has also accused Musk’s X of allowing Russian propaganda about Ukraine to spread on its website.

A study released last week by the European Commission, the governing body of the European Union, found that “the reach and influence of Kremlin-backed accounts has grown further in the first half of 2023.”

The study said that the increased reach of Russian propaganda online was “largely driven by Twitter, where engagement grew by 36% after CEO Elon Musk decided to lift mitigation measures on Kremlin-backed accounts”.

Musk on Friday attempted to refute the EU study, writing on his social media platform: “Where is all this pro-Russian propaganda? We don’t see it.”


archive: https://archive.ph/wip/ENe3P

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] robbotlove@lemmy.world 135 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Musk defended his decision, saying he did not want his SpaceX company to be “explicitly complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation”.

lol well you fucking failed bro because that's exactly what happened.

[–] Cylusthevirus@kbin.social 87 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Right?

The "escalation" was the invasion, Elon, you simpering pile of shit.

[–] Puzzle_Sluts_4Ever@lemmy.world 36 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

musk is clearly a russian sympathizer, if not asset, as has been documented time and time again among conservatives/fascists.

But this is pretty much the same verbiage that NATO has been using the entire time. We want to help Ukraine but don't want to escalate.

Assuming anyone cares enough to investigate this, that will hold up as far as the international crimes thing goes. Whether The Pentagon is cool with this is a very different discussion.

load more comments (5 replies)
[–] BlinkerFluid@lemmy.one 16 points 1 year ago

Giving a bunch of them to Ukraine as a marketing tactic... wasn't being explicitly complicit in a major act of war?

Where is the line at? Space?

[–] Uprise42@artemis.camp 121 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I call bullshit. He sold them fucking internet as a fucking contract with the damn Pentagon. What else would they be used for. If you wanted to use that excuse then you should’ve never made the contract. This was planned from the start. He sold the contract to have greater control over their military operations. This is just the first of a long line of items to come

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/06/01/pentagon-awards-spacex-with-ukraine-contract-for-starlink-satellite-internet.html

[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 69 points 1 year ago (2 children)

He sold them fucking internet as a fucking contract with the damn Pentagon.

Sounds an awful lot like Elon Musk defrauded the Pentagon.

[–] Caradoc879@lemmy.world 45 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Sounds an awful lot like elon musk needs to be sent to the Russian front his fucking self. I hope ukraine charges him as a Russian spy and puts out a bounty on him.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] TheDarkKnight@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago

Sounds kinda like somebody is playing both sides and needs a strong reminder as to what hand feeds him.

[–] o0joshua0o@lemmy.world 40 points 1 year ago

Yep. With something like this you're either all in or all out. You don't half-ass military support.

[–] thefartographer@lemm.ee 67 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Turns out if you're rich enough, you get to try out the trolly problem in real life and then brag about it in your biography.

That needs to be the meme that goes around.

[–] Rapidcreek@reddthat.com 42 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If he did it to the US while we were at war we would call it treason.

[–] Neato@kbin.social 34 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Instead he merely did it to a strong US ally to benefit a long-time US adversary. An adversary we have practically as many sanctions on as is feasible before it becomes a declaration of war.

I don't know what crime this is. Logan Act violation? But at this point Starlink is being used as a strategic asset in a US ally's war and should be seized by the US government as a military asset.

[–] Rapidcreek@reddthat.com 14 points 1 year ago

I'm sure that DOD lawyers are taring through the contract they signed with him. But, since the dumb SOB admitted to it, if the contract doesn't have a provision to let him do this they can sue him under carriage laws. Ending with the government taking away his operating license and siezing his operating network. The DOD has been wanting to create their own such network in any case.

[–] Spendrill@lemm.ee 41 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Just asking, does anybody still like this cunt?

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Sadly, he has a bunch of dedicated fanboys on his precious website.

[–] ZeroCool@feddit.ch 9 points 1 year ago

They're all over reddit too. There's nothing more pathetic than witnessing a thread get brigaded by a bunch of Muskrats. Imagine living vicariously though the immature twitter antics of a white supremacist billionaire. They're clowns.

[–] nutbiggums@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 year ago

Other dumb cunts do, but not as many as before

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] breadsmasher@lemmy.world 33 points 1 year ago (1 children)

putin ballhandler chose to fuck over ukraine?

[–] theodewere@kbin.social 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

what he really wants is to slide into Putin's seat, and play the whole world the same way Vlad does

[–] Neato@kbin.social 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Man, I hope he tries that and moves to Moscow. The oligarchs would eat him alive and it would be some prime schadenfreude to watch.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] MiltownClowns@lemmy.world 33 points 1 year ago (13 children)

Elon Musk is skirting with making StarLink one of the first nationalized companies in the US in a long time. Lets hope its a domino for all ISPs.

jk i hear spectrum and at&t are merging to one company to be called "lmao, get fucked america"

load more comments (13 replies)
[–] iforgotmyinstance@lemmy.world 28 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Ukraine. Southeast Montana. Doesn't matter.

Aiding and abetting governments hostile to the US and its allies is treason. Musk is a fraud, a traitor and deserves to be imprisoned.

[–] kjpctech@lemm.ee 7 points 1 year ago

Southeast Montana?

[–] Iwasondigg@lemmy.one 26 points 1 year ago

How is he not like a rouge nation unto himself at this point? He's deciding the outcome of international conflicts. We are truly an oligarchy.

[–] dojan@lemmy.world 25 points 1 year ago (1 children)

My gods just shoot the man already so we can stop hearing about him.

[–] wetnoodle@sopuli.xyz 18 points 1 year ago (2 children)

there should be a bounty on the fucker

The bounty wouldn't even have to be money, at this point if you promised to give people twitter back instead, you'd still get interested parties.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] someguy3@lemmy.ca 21 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Oh no see he prevented Moscow nuking Ukraine by doing this. What a hero! /s

I can't believe we live in this society of appeasers. Him and the Republicans. I remember a time when Republicans accused Democrats of not being able to stand up to dictators, and now they are full throttle.

[–] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I remember the last time we tried appeasement on a belligerent authoritarian state. It worked so well in the end, didn't it?

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] norbert@kbin.social 9 points 1 year ago

It's always projection, every accusation is an admission.

[–] MisterMoo@kbin.social 21 points 1 year ago (6 children)
load more comments (6 replies)
[–] xc2215x@lemmy.world 15 points 1 year ago

What a complete jackass Elon is.

[–] theodewere@kbin.social 13 points 1 year ago (1 children)

he took sides and engaged in a military conflict, there's no other way to see it.. he doesn't have that authority, no matter what technology his little company controls..

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] JoJoGAH@lemmy.world 12 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I can't be the only person who wondered "what's his real motive" when he volunteered these for free, knowing much of what he is known for. I guess people he's visited in DC have benefitted as well, because surely they knew this wouldn't go well, right?

[–] SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca 6 points 1 year ago

Elon Musk is an attention starved and has the mentality of an impulsive spoiled child. Slava Ukraini was trending, so he wanted to insert himself into it to get attention. Probably thought Ukraine would lose so he gets a little attention for trying to help these guys fighting the good fight before they were ultimately crushed by Russia.

But that didn't happen. Ukraine continues on and what he thought of as a little in the moment publicity stunt obligated him to helping Ukraine. While most people would happy with the result, but scared little child Elon Musk felt he was in over his head. And being the impulsive child he is, started doing impulsive shit and interfered in an active military conflict, compromising an ally's mission.

It's hard to say how much DC is in the know. It is a new tech, glitches happen, so they might not have suspected Musk was the glitch in the system.

[–] CrabAndBroom@lemmy.ml 9 points 1 year ago

I was talking about this with someone today, and pondering what would happen if a private Ukrainian citizen had decided to deliberately fuck up an American military action, and what the American response would be.

The closest I could think of was Julian Assange, a non-US citizen who leaked a bunch of US military info and probably somewhat fucked up whatever they were up to at the time, or at least drew more attention to it than they would have liked. They're currently trying to extradite him to the US for "conspiracy to commit computer intrusion" and who knows what they'll do to him when that inevitably gets pushed through. I guess Chelsea Manning's treatment is probably some indicator for that too.

So anyway, I expect Elon Musk will probably be extradited to Ukraine and spend a year or so in solitary confinement there right away. Maybe hide in an embassy for a few years first?

[–] bela@lemm.ee 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

tHe sOCIaL mEdIA pLATfOrm foRmERLy KnOwN aS tWITtER

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] kryptonianCodeMonkey@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Musk defended his decision, saying he did not want his SpaceX company to be “explicitly complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation”.

So, in the classic trolley problem, Elon's choice is to remove the track switch that his company produced so that no one else could use it to make a choice.

"Sorry, guys. Looks like those innocent civilians tied to the tracks are going to have to die so that I am not tangentially and tenuously responsible for your choice to save them in exchange for the deaths of Russian soldiers attacking your sovereign lands and people (cough and lose money from the Kremlin as a result cough)"

There's no "right" answer to the trolley problem. But there are definitely wrong ones.

load more comments
view more: next ›