No Stupid Questions

Because they're the "FA" part in ANTIFA

I feel like this is obvious.

(For the record, I voted blue in the last election.)

The vast majority of America's view on antifa falls somewhere between "they should all be arrested" and "they're kids who mean well, but are using the wrong methods".

Do not know what “ANTIFA” truly means?

This seems like the easiest point to explain. A name doesn't have to mean exactly what it says, and everyone knows this. I could just as easily say "Why are you opposed to MAGA? Do you not want America to be great?" You, presumably, do want America to be great (according to your own definion of "great") - but you don't support MAGA. Why? Because MAGA is not the amorphous concept of making America better. It is a political movement with its own cultural context, specific goals, typical methodology, vocal supporters, etc. This is very easy to understand.

Same with Antifa. Sure, the word literally means "antifascist", but people are going to look at the broader context of their actions, their goals, and the people who are actually in the movement.

I will step back for a monent and say that I personally know little about what the antifa movement actually does. Maybe they spend most of their time operating soup kitchens or lobbying politicians for electoral system reforms with greater transparency. But for the purposes of this question, that is all irrelivant, since this question is about perception.

And what is the perception of antifa? Of what they actually do, who they actually are, and what they actually want? The perception is an angry young man wearing all black throwing a brick through a Starbucks window. His goal is to bring down the amorphous concept of "the system" or "capitalism" via violent extremism to create a world of anarchy - without much of a plan for what to do afterwards if he ever succeeded (which he won't). The mainstream dislikes this, because in the case that he succeeds (which is unlikely) we would very predictably have everything good in our lives ruined - jobs, stability, secure finances, enough food, clean water, physical safety, etc - because these things depend on the continuation of the system we live in. And in the case he fails, now they have to endure an annoying draft when buying coffee until Starbucks can replace the window. And the mainstream left especially don't like him because they feel like he is setting them back politically by associating more left leaning ideas with violence and instability, which most people dislike.

This doesn't really have anything to do with MAGA. The mainstream does not view these as two equal and opposite factions where one side is clearly good and the other evil. The mainstream sees ICE deporting Australians to El Salvador and says "oh, I don't like that". And then they see antifa rioting and say "oh, I don't like that either". You may ask that if the mainstream's plan isn't supporting antifascism, then what is their plan, and the fact is, they don't need to have a plan to have a opinion about what they do and don't like. People don't like slaughterhouse conditions, but still eat bacon. They don't like climate change, but still want to buy a fancy sports car. The views of any given person will almost never form a logically sound thesis for an idealized state of the world, because people don't think logically. We see the world, we feel emotional responses, and then we spin up just enough of a logical framework to support our emotional response.... That's it.

Sorry, didn't answer your other questions.

For questions 2 and 3, Trump supporters feel their lives are much better under Trump? Why? Because "their side" is in charge. Really, that's it. Humans are emotional. Part of our emotional system is tribalism - our side in charge good. Their side in charge bad. Most MAGA voters live in a political fairy tale where good ol'fashioned America has been under attack from "The Liberals" for decades, and now Trump is here to save us. What exactly constitudes the America we want to return to, and why any given action is justifiable in order to achieve those ends are, again, logical justifications made up post hoc in order to respond to emotional responses. These logical reasons can be bolstered by a steady stream of right wing media, which is the only media they consume - again, because it justifies their emotional responses.

As Victor Frankl said - man can endure any what, just as long as he has a why (or something like that). Well, man can justify any what just as long as he likes his why. Trump is president = my person is president = egg prices are reasonable.

Fascism is capitalism in decay. It's what you can sell right now. A modern definition is "moral belief in inequality based on identity (race / gender)". This is what is selling right now because the dream of prosperity with liberalism is over. Shit's bad. So that is what the propaganda channels have been churning out, on on fox, on social media, on youtube for younger audiences. Ultimately the reason is greed for money / priviledge by people without scruples.

Check out What Is Fascism? An Excerpt From “Fascism Today: What It Is and How to End It” | Truthout

It's only going to get worse from now on.

The GOP doesn't think they are fascists. They think the term is only being used to try to deride them without actually being correct. From there, when they see "Anti-fascists" constantly opposing THEM, they think it's just some violent group that has used an ad hominem attack for their name.

It would be comparable to someone making an anti-shithead group, and then that group is always out trying to stop you from doing whatever you do. Not only would they be a direct problem for you, but the fact that they're targeting you would imply then that they're also calling you a shithead.

same reason they think vaccines are bad.

Not trolling.

But randomly capitalizing words to express your outrage is off-putting. So is pointing at your PhD multiple times when you feel defensive.

Anyway, the answer to your first question answers the rest.

Not everyone agrees that fascism is bad. Yes, it's what we were supposed to learn in school. But our country has its own history of genocide, racism, and hate. And we largely teach that greed and stepping on others is how to get ahead. I mean, we're taught the golden rule. But also to be successful even if it means turning a blind eye to the harms you cause.

Our unresolved racial and genocidal karma is also very easy to tap into when folks are scared or feeling stepped on.

Which makes it very easy for a demogague to make the case, you know, maybe fascism isn't that bad.

Couple this with billion dollar propaganda machines and a lack of critical thinking skills taught in some religions and educational systems, and most folks on the right don't realize that anti-antifa is logically pro-fascim. And the rest don't care as long as they get theirs and the right people get hurt.

So, to your first question (about Antifa), MAGA don't consider what the current administration (or anything they support) to be fascist. Because they tend to put the conclusion before the question: "I am against fascism. I support these policies. Therefore these policies must not be fascist."

And because they've decided these fascist policies are not fascist, the term "Antifa" to them is similar to "pro-life" for pro-choice people. It's a term that isn't exactly accurate but makes the group naming themselves look like the good guys. And in the same way that pro-choice people don't consider themselves "anti-life" just because pro-life people call themselves that, MAGA people don't consider themselves "pro-fascist" just because Antifa call themsleves that.

I hung around anti-SJW groups in 2016 and I'm assuming not much has changed.

Basically ANTIFA is painted as a violent group that claims normal things as "fascist", same as the "leftists" call "normal people" "nazis". People in these right-leaning circles get shown videos of protests after they go violent and innocent people / property starts getting damaged and are told it's ANTIFA (I don't know how much actually is ANTIFA, I don't follow this stuff anymore). The name of the organisation does not matter because the right does not believe the things they are protesting against to be fascist, thus ANTIFA becomes a lie in their mind.

Looking at it from a leftist perspective, think of tactics like all the bills named the "Protect Our Children" act (or some such) that tries to strip rights away under an innocent-sounding name. Right-wing sees ANTIFA the same as you would see these law names: a deception to calm the masses.

Seems pretty obvious, no? Antifa is left-wing and the GOP is right-wing. They are opposed to each other on just about everything.

Fascists don't believe that fascism is bad.

And I guess that's correct when you're a narcissistic psychopath whose in charge.

Maybe everyone outside the GOP should start using the full name instead of "antifa". "the anti fascists are the enemy" doesn't sound the same way.

Because they've been fearmongering about them for a decade.

If you're anti-Antifa, you're fa, as in fascist. It's really as simple as that.

because they're PROFA

I'm not American but Dutch, but our far-right government also really hates Antifa so the answer is probably similar.

1. Antifa is anti-fascist, yeah. But the name is most often not used by all people who are anti-fascist but rather by a rather extreme subgroup of people who have a tendency to escalate protests into riots. They often seem to fight for something good, but not really with the means that are approved by the more centre-leaning average people.

2. Both MAGA and the Dutch far right are also a bit fascist, although MAGA is more advanced in that regard, so they probably don't really vibe with anti-fascism anyway. It's all populist politics. They outlaw the "scary left-wing terrorists" to both vilify the left and show their voters that they care about law and order.

Everyone (pretty much) agrees that fascism is bad, but Antifa is a movement that means more than anti fascism. Antifa is branding or marketing in the same way that the anti defamation league is, or like the patriot act put a certain spin on a bill that stripped privacy rights from citizens. Groups use branding to gain power and aren't all encompassing as to their motives or actions. In the case of antifa it's less of an actual organization and more of a rallying cry that gets used for a wide variety of people with different motives, and it's detractors point to a wide variety of actions or intents (real or imagined) when criticizing it.

Because maga are human and they have similar capabilities to us.

For example, I know you know that they are often draped in Christianity, patriotism, etc. Does that mean we're all anti-christian and anti-american? We see right through their camouflage.

They learn to associate us with certain labels. And then they learn new labels in the context of labels they've internalized. Antifa means a bunch of things that mean a bunch of things that mean a bunch of things.

So look. That's like asking why people are not Libertarians. A name is just a name. Everyone knows this. Actions matter a lot more.

Holy fuck that is practically impossible to read. It's like something I would expect to see in grandma's facebook circles, not from an alleged former teacher.

If you're looking from sense from maga folks you're not going to get it, if you want to hear from voting liberals you will get your confirmation, but yeesh. There are, I believe, three questions buried in there and I can't even bring myself to join the search party.

I think this sub may be wrong. There are some stupid questions.

if we all agree, that “Fascism”, is wrong

Republicans do not agree.

If so please give me examples and FACTS

It's a religion, they have faith which is more powerful than facts.

They are FA

Antifa has been branded by the GOP as a group that does not follow a specific ideology purely focused on fascism, they've been marked as a "dangerous, violent, leftist (important point) group."

The politicians are using the antifa boogyman as a political tool and the MAGA supporters are just opposing a group they see as "leftist terrorists." In their eyes it has nothing to do with any kind of "legitimate" resistance to fascism so they'll outright reject the notion that being against Antifa means your for fascism.

They've been conditioned to absolutely loath anyone on the left with the most pure burning hatred, so in using the qualifier "leftist" in their description they invoke the thought terminating process, leftist means you hate them without thought, and antifa is now a label you can put on anyone you want to persecute. The "base" may have been conditioned to despise "the left," but I think we're still at the point where the right can't simply say "we're arresting them because they're Democrats that are protesting our actions" so they need this "dangerous terrorist group" to exist as the enemy.

propaganda based on classic mussolini style hate. you pick the opponent who doesnt want you to ruin everything, and advertise them as evil.

are you really a history teacher?

Because they are the "Fa"

The people in charge dislike Antifa because people who align under that label oppose those in power.

I hesitate to use the argument "'Antifa' means 'anti-fascist' therefore if you don't like Antifa you are necessarily fascist"--not because I don't believe it's true, but because I believe it's more correlation. The "National Socialist" party was not as its name purports, nor do many of the "Protect the children" laws actually do what they say on the tin; therefore a deeper inspection on acts, means, motives, and results is warranted over a mere "literal definition of the name."

The GOP also has issues with DEI, which stands for Diversity, Equity and Inclusion.

Their followers are either not smart enough to realize, and will parrot what they hear, and thereby spread more hate, or they're willingly malevolent.