Overview:
Electric Vehicles are a key part of our tomorrow and how we get there. If we can get all the fossil fuel vehicles off our roads, out of our seas and out of our skies, we'll have a much better environment. This community is where we discuss the various different vehicles and news stories regarding electric transportation.
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im only down for this only if they give is the same 20+ gears they had in the Fast and the Furious movies.
And don't forget all the reverse gears
or every racing movie...he's going to lose...oh wait, he has six more gears and he forgot to use the gas pedal!!
or every racing movie
Ehm, no, it's actually every movie that has a car engine sound.
Flat road with constant speed?
Jup, periodic constant upshifting.
They are going supersonic.
It's infinite gears. You upshift and the simulated revs drop then roar up again, even if you're not accelerating. Then it does it every time you shift until you get bored.
I guess some people really like leaving some performance on the table
You don’t buy a manual car because it’s faster.
You buy it because it’s more fun.
But in a manual car you’re the reason why it’s slower.
In an EV (or CVT) dumb programming is why it’s slower.
It’s still more fun with the shift points.
Spinning is so much cooler than not spinning.
As a manual car owner and sincere enjoyer: it’s utterly stupid to simulate a transmission’s acceleration behavior in an electric car. It’s entirely artificial and synthetic, and not only irrelevant and unconnected to the mechanics of the drivetrain in anything more than a cosmetic sense, but also a detriment to performance. This is simulating how it feels to drive a car with a PDK in it, and some paddles. That’s it. It’s even more stupid than the flappy paddles and faked gearing they put into Subaru’s CVTs - that at least has an auditory component as a justification.
Hyundai did this with the Ioniq-N. They faked the noise, vibration, even a rev limiter.
Where this is going: Electric cars blended with driving simulators.
Maybe public transportation will really take off once everyone on board gets a VR headset with a driving simulator.
Commute to work on an empty Swiss mountain road in a Ferrari.
You don’t buy a manual car because it’s faster.
Nowadays no, but back a few (alright many) years ago, manuals were both quicker AND more fuel efficient. Drivetrain losses in autos were bad, and the better gearing and more gears in manual vs auto meant they were quicker off the mark and could cruise at an optimal rpm with better efficiency.
This is idiotic.
I can imagine a world where paddle shifters control throttle and regen behavior. Like "downshifting" from a gentle lift and coast to heavy regen-braking in steps, same with "upshifting" from max torque to gentle eco-mode. Would make EVs even more amazing for people like me actually.
But this, this is stupid.
As stupid as calling an EV "Turbo"?
Porsche lost the plot a long time ago.
My first PC had a Turbo button.
Its purpose was to make the CPU slower.
Porsche hasn't lost the plot - they build this stuff intentionally because they know idiots will buy it. It pads their bottom line and lets them continue to make the higher end 911s.
This is idiotic.
So im guessing you dont like a drivers car which is what porsche's market is catered too. If you dont like that its completely fine. But for people like me who enjoy manual cars and having something thats engaging to drive give me an ev that simulates ice vehicle dynamics any day. Seeing this means more people who bought ice cars because they were more engaging for track days might be buying evs in the future. That means less noise pollution near race tracks and a more ecologically friendly motor sport. Calling this idiotic is just a bad take, you're clearly not the market for a drivers car and that fine but dont act like there arent others out there who are waiting for things like this. I like that the ionic 5n does this behavior and seeing more performance cars take this approach means hopefully a shift in a sport I enjoy but is not ecologically friendly might become more so in the future. Plus I can have all the pops and bangs of an ice engine in my car without having to bother anyone outside it :D
I think you haven't understood my message, and probably not the article itself.
What Porsche does is simulate the behavior of a torque converter automatic transmission. The opposite of a "drivers car" as you put it.
What I'm suggesting is the opposite. Use paddle shifters to alter acceleration and regen torque in a way that's similar to a sequential or semi-auto transmission. "Downshift" to increase regen (engine breaking) and accel torque, just like downshifting in a petrol car. "Upshift" to reduce them. With the added benefit of zero emissions and the ability to stay in whichever "gear mode" you want.
FWIW I've driven manuals for 20 years and although my latest car is a hybrid and the next will be electric, I still "drive" manual in sim racing.
It if is a toggle feature, fine. But I kind of dont see the point. Like, I daily-drive stick shift but when I had automatic, the best fucking part was that it would speed up seamlessly and smoothly with a nice even motor sound. No jiggling, chugging or anything. Just a smooth easy ride. Why would anyone want stick shift in an automatic? Bemuses me.
Porsches are drivers' cars. They're mostly not about smoothness and "making sense to own".
They WERE drivers cars. Real Porsche clubs avoid the modern cars.
A toggle would be good.
Cars with automatic gears are more efficient than manual ones. I fear a fake manual gear system would decrease efficiency, so it may be best to disable it.
Car people vs. normal people lol
As an infrequent driver I really enjoy not needing to shift
I don't get this kind of stuff at all. And this is coming from someone who drives a manual transmission car. Electric cars don't need transmissions, why would I want to pretend to shift gears? It's like the fake engine noise. Very silly.
Nissan did this a while ago in response to customer complaints. People were complaining about the lack of power and acceleration in cars with CVTs, so instead of actually fixing the problem, Nissan introduced programming in their car that simulates shifting. When you get on the freeway and floor the accelerator to get up.to speed, the revs will go up to about 5 or 6k and then will "downshift" to 2-3k while "shifting" through gears. Anybody that knows what a CVT actually is knows there are no gears to shift and acceleration should be happening at a constant engine RPM.
Basically, people are too dumb to realize they bought a horrendously underpowered shitbox, so Nissan gave those people the equivalent of visual cues and some engine noises to make them feel better about it.
You have to imagine the people who made this do engine noises while they drive
I once saw a concept car for an EV at a trade fair and their selling point was that it had a sound system to realistically emulate engine noises. You could even pick among 50 or so cars it could emulate. As far as I remember the noises were only played inside.
My cat makes little vroom noises when he gets the zoomies.
As someone who owned CVTs with and without fake gears and EVs: gear shifts quickly become awful after you've lived without them for a while.
But why? I drive an EV and it's way better than a manual (I'm getting too old for that crap), and nothing like an automatic.
Plus putting your foot down in an EV and letting it rip is like nothing else, gears would ruin that fun.
Is it practical? No. Is it less efficient? Yes. Is it fun? Apparently yes! Assuming Porsche will have a similar implementation it's more than just noise, it actually simulates a torque curve as you go through the gears.
So lame.
They know that male Porsche owners will only play with this type of stick with a big knob on top.
Ahem, the knob is in the driver's seat.
Porsche making its cars deliberately slower and less convenient. Stupid stupid stupid.
Sorry but I think having presets is better. My MG4 (lower end of the EVs) has one "sport" preset and you can fell the difference with the normal preset.
I drive an ancient (2012) EV.
I'm content with a stick shift, but the functions I want are:
...and that's all, and I have them. I don't need acceleration performance to change, much safer to have it always consistent. It's the default braking performance I need to alter, because sometimes you go downhill and sometimes it's icy.
They're electronic, no mechanical pushrods needed, but my car's manufacturer, in the dark dawn of electric vehicles, could not understand that and used mechanical pushrods. :D
A function that is mechanical and which I would like to remove from my car's gear stick and place under a separate switch is the "gear lock" function. It's like a parking brake without engaging brake pads. It's useful, but having it under the stick creates a nozero possibility of engaging it in motion - it shouldn't be there, but under a protective cover or protective circuit, elsewhere.
For the gear lock, You might find it has an interlock and can't be engaged above a certain speed.
I honestly have no idea about evs but as a crane technician interlocks (system reads x state before allowing you to happen) prevent all kinds of accidental applications of certain systems.
For instance a franna has a switch on the dash from high to low range, even if you press this switch at 80kmh until the transmission registers a speed below 2kmh it will not allow that to happen.
Yep, that's how it should be.
In reality, I've been able to engage gear lock at a low speed. Whatever interlock they (Mitsubishi) have built - ain't 100% foolproof.