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Justice Neil Gorsuch, who was also appointed by Trump, added to the pressure Sauer faced, asking the seasoned Solicitor General: “Do you think Native Americans are birthright citizens under your test?”
“Ah, I think... so,” he replied, somewhat unconvincingly. “I’ll have to think that through.”
Is that literally the first time he's thought about that?
Think is too strong a term here.
Been made aware.
Aware is too strong a term.
It could be. The point of bringing a case like this probably isn't to win it, necessarily, but to demonstrate loyalty to dear leader. Dear Leader wants the case in order to push the Overton window. Its a can't-lose situation for the regime; they get some benefit from either judicial decision.
The mission is to flood the zone in the hopes that some of their bullshit slips through. The more of it that fails, the better. I don't think losing this ruling is a mortal blow for MAGA in any sense, but it will be better for Americans if this is one of the ones that fails.
Deport those ungrateful native Americans back to…America???
I suggest you deport them back to where they came from, typically the nicer, more habitable parts of the United States, and give them whatever is there now. It's a poor deal for the Lenape, though, as they'd get New Jersey.
The Trump admin doesn't actually care where someone is from, they just get sent to a hole somewhere in El Salvador or South Sudan.
If you put a "> " on the empty line then the quote formatting line thingy will be contiguous.
> Like
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I fucking hate that guy and his stupid asshole voice.
Can someone explain this to a clueless European? Are Native Americans not American Citizens by default?
That's was the point of the question. By birthright they are but under the MAGA interpretation (ie utter bullshit and making things up) they may not be because technically they have tribal affiliation and could be considered beholden to another government. It all makes much more sense when you try not to think about it logically. They are literally trying to argue the clause of the Constitution that says if you are born on USA territory you are US citizen doesn't mean exactly that. It is the most unambiguous amendment because they knew the former confereracy would try this shit eventually.
It's complicated, they are citizens in most cases, but they also have distinctly different rights in some cases. It works out to them being a sort of hybrid citizen, as they are ultimately subject to most federal laws, but can't be subjected to state laws. They are allowed to vote in elections though suppression is common. This status has resulted in them running casinos in most states, as the state can't prevent them from doing it on tribal land, it's also expanded to betting apps.
Along with that, they are protected by international treaties because some tribal lands straddle the border between the US and Canada or Mexico. As nations that pre-date colonialism, they’re allowed to move freely within their lands, which might take them over an international border.
So someone might be born on tribal lands in Canada but live in the US and have tribal rights, but not be an American. Or vice versa.
I'm not really sure what Gorsuch was getting at with his question, but my understanding is that Native Americans are not citizens by the 14th amendment, because tribes are sovereign entities, and therefore fall into the "not subject to the jurisdiction" part of that amendment. However, they are granted citizenship by the Indian Citizenship Act of 1924.
Oh I'm sure he's thought of it, but can't say the truth out loud because it will make him look bad.
A space launch and the Supreme Court doing its job?
It's like america has a functioning government!!
/s
It's April 1st. Maybe it's just a prank
Complete with Buzz Aldrin to punch folks in the face.
Gorsuch asked if Native Americans would be considered birthright citizens, and the MAGA lawyer said he'd "have to give it some thought."
Shouldn't he have done that BEFORE appearing in front of SCOTUS?
Honestly though, if the Supreme Court were doing their job even slightly properly, the response from the justices to that facile punt of an answer to a very obvious question should have been to utterly excoriate the lawyer - up to, and hopefully including, dismissal with prejudice. The response that fucker gave shows a very obvious lack of preparedness and consideration - or more likely, very thinly veiled contempt of the court.
Roberts replied: “It’s a new world. It’s the same Constitution.”
There's the Chief I know. Originalist in the streets, textualist in the sheets.
"Come 'ere baby, I'm going to 3rd amendment that behind of yours..."
FYI: About 35 countries have birthright citizenship, mostly on the American continent. Over 150 countries have citizenship by descent.
Yeah, I always thought that was neat since it's mostly a happy accident from needing to allow freed slaves citizenship. I much prefer that over some sort of bloodline metric.
Alito sounded like a completely obtuse nincomcoop today. You don’t need to be a constitutional lawyer to see how full of shit the conservatives are.
For some reason I can't imagine Trump without a full diaper anymore. When I see the news that he went to SCOTUS hearing I'm thinking "and he was sitting there in a full diaper?". I'm reading that he stormed out and I'm thinking "he can walk with a full diaper? what's that like?". Full diaper is now integral part of his image for me, can't help it.
And Chief Justice John Roberts, another conservative on the bench, also had something of a mic-drop moment when Sauer tried to make the point that “we’re in a new world where eight billion people are one plane ride away from having a child who’s a U.S citizen.”
Roberts replied: “It’s a new world. It’s the same Constitution.”
I expect this is where they pivot next. What does it take to amend the American constitution? Or what does it take to make a new one, given that they will try to justify that an old document does not fit the modern world
It would be impossible in today's political climate.
You need >66% vote in both House and Senate, or you need a Constitutional Convention called by >66% of the state legislatures. Then you need to ratify the amendment, which requires approval by >75% of state legislatures.
What could pass 75% of states?
In this day and age it amazes me we ever had that level of consensus. Something is super broken.
New world same constitution... God they're right. And I totally agree Trump would change it if he possibly could.
He had a poopy diaper and he needed someone to wipe his pedo bum
Trump has never once felt humiliated in his life.
I don't know, I tend to believe the theory that Trump ran for President because Obama made fun of him at that correspondents dinner. He looked pretty humiliated that night
That (imo) was anger at being on the wrong side of a power imbalance. Some might argue that's humiliation, but I think it's different. To be humiliated, you have to be able to see yourself as inferior in some way. Trump is not capable of that.
"Humiliated" "storms out" - this is some tabloidly language.
headlines like that are why I stopped going to any Meidas network content
I think they really fucked themselves over with that. like, sure, some of the time it was an accurate serious statement (but not enough people in america care, so it appeared that it wasn't actually as serious but in fact it was just the response to it that was not serious), but a lot of the time they just use clickbait titles and then you're sitting there like wait that's it?
This calls for a return to form. Happy YDAU everyone.
I wonder if he did harm by being there.
They were all like "this btch trying to intimidate us? Let's show him what "equal branch" means"
Absolutely. Judges do not like people pulling stunts in their courtroom, and unless Trump actually goes full dictator by disolving congress, he can't touch them and they know it. He can't intimidate them, so all trying does is piss them off. This might cause the conservative members to stop following his playbook so much, but it's hard to say for sure.
more like trump storms out to create a gaffe at distracting the media from epstein. it happens everytime epstein starts rearing its head, or when something he did was too severe for the media to ignore.
It’s exhausting to hear this, but 100% true. Trump creates daily outrage so there’s no oxygen in the room to focus on his crimes. We were talking about unredacting the files, holding Trump to account in the court of public opinion, and everything fell away again because he used our military to wage war. It’s taken over the conversation, again, with what remains being posts like these reminding people almost in vain that hey, if Trump breathes a word or walks from point A to B while on camera, its to distract the public from organizing over the truth that he is a narcissistic rapist pedophile with the ability to end the world.
Humiliation? Like he's capable of it. He tweeted they were dumb as he left. As far as he's concerned, he won.
If they'd cancelled it, would that be retroactiv? Revoking the citizenship of every US American not of native heritage would be one hell of a move.
Don't be silly. They will only revoke the citizenship of non-white citizens, including native Americans.
"We are the only Country in the World STUPID enough to allow “Birthright”...
Don't most countries allow birthright citizenship?
Waiting for inevitable EO that says after talking to some of the "greatest legal minds" (no doubt just his own reflection) it has been determined that he "has the absolute right" to dissolve/suspend SCOTUS if they're going to stand in the way of him enforcing the law. Cue him using the military to shutdown the building and prevent SCOTUS from convening and Mike Johnson will just shrug and say something like "Well, they knew what would happen. It's not our job to save their branch of gov't" when questioned on why Congress won't impeach.