Not buying it and certainly not clicking on it. I've never heard of Siena and the Times is so conservative they only make right turns on the drive home from work. Trump hasn't won a popular vote yet.
this post was submitted on 02 Mar 2024
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Less than half of the country wants Trump or Biden.
~~Wrong way to read it. Of the polled people, more want Trump than Biden~~
Possibly unreliable poll, see here https://lemmy.world/post/12773276
Who was polled? People that voted in the primaries. Why would democrats show up to a primary unless they wanted Biden to lose? This article is sensational bullshit.
Only 23 percent of Democratic primary voters said they were enthusiastic about Mr. Biden — half the share of Republicans who said they were about Mr. Trump. Significantly more Democrats said they were either dissatisfied or angry at Mr. Biden being the leader of the party (32 percent) than Republicans who said the same about Mr. Trump (18 percent)
Raise your hand if you or anyone you know was polled. There’s no way Trump is gaining voters. The only way he wins is if Democrats stay home and don’t vote.
The polls that are showing up all seem to have flaws like this.
It is way too early to know anything in this election anyhow. I've been following it closely and it is going to be a circus. Trump is showing mounting signs of dementia in his speeches as each one worst than the last. The stress of massive court judgment deadlines approaching seem to be breaking him as his best shot at getting 4 Billion vanishes before his eyes. Meanwhile Biden looks like your average retirement home resident. Don't get me wrong, I like what he's done, but both of them are just too damn old for this.
I don't understand how Trump can remain a candidate at this rate if he winds up broke (he owes NYS half a billion) and in jail (the New York election tampering case) by the summer. It's fucking insane and I love following it with existential dread and morbid curiosity.
Well in our electoral system, that literally couldn't matter less, so maybe focus on that issue another time?
"Another time" never arrives.
That doesn't stop them from repeating this line verbatim every election though.
Well one of these candidates runs a cult and will not lose votes from divisive bullshit like this.
So feel free to split the rest of the vote and bring Trump back, I guess 🤷♂️ I'm lucky enough to be in a position to leave if it happens, not everyone is so fortunate
So, your plan is to bury your head in the sand rather than hold the people who've co-run the show this whole time accountable for anything, and when that doesn't work, you'll just leave? And you're treating me like the asshole here?
So, your plan is to bury your head in the sand rather than hold the people who've co-run the show this whole time accountable for anything
My plan is to vote against the person trying to destroy our country, instead of actively helping him get elected by splitting the vote. You will never elect a third party in our current system, and Democrats are 10,000,000% more likely to work towards a different system (a non-dictatorial one, anyway).
You can throw your vote away or not, that's totally your choice. If you choose to actually participate, then you can either vote for an ineffective, way-too-old, status-quo supporter or you can vote for someone who wants to remove your ability to vote and start political prisons. That's it, those are your only two choices.
and when that doesn't work, you'll just leave? And you're treating me like the asshole here?
...yes, absolutely. I'm sorry, but why would I choose to stay in a country that is all but guaranteed to slide into a military dictatorship that is actively working against my beliefs and the people that hold them? If you haven't seen Trump's plans, then I suggest you do some reading.
why would I choose to stay in a country that is all but guaranteed to slide into a military dictatorship
you should have packed your bags a long time ago.
We’re fucked.
A straight-up nationwide poll is less significant than what polls in swing states are doing.
Trump is ahead there as well, but that's what's going to matter in terms of the election, not nationwide polling.
Show me one shred of evidence that Trump is ahead in swing states that isn’t some poorly orchestrated poll. Election Day is the only day that matters, every thing else is propaganda.
Not necessarily, things can change quickly. Organizing voters matter.
So does alienating them, which is where the bulk of the effort seems to be going.
I hope so. Christ on a shitstick.
Oh yeah we are....
Remember- most people don't even start really paying attention to the election until the end of the summer.
After the shit show that was polling with 2016, I seriously doubt any polls get much valid data now. Or that it holds long enough to change anything. The crazy way our system is set up, there's like IDK, maybe 100,000 people who basically vote randomly each election that makes the difference. In 2024 I have to think if in March you're still voting Trump, he could probably show up, rape your wife and daughter and you'd still think come November, better than Biden.
On the Democratic side, I can't actually think what policy position would make you think Trump would get you closer to your desired goals. I know the media doesn't like to talk about it, but it's not like Trump is any more with it. At least Biden is getting confused between 2 ongoing crisis that exist while Trump is randomly talking about magnets and water. You can't convince me one is sharper than the other or in better health, or more likely to live out a 4 year term.
It's more about who's actually showing up to vote, and in that case I think Biden has the uphill battle because for reasons that escape me, Trump gets people more excited.
and in that case I think Biden has the uphill battle because for reasons that escape me
Mostly because he sucks. Gaza and the border are the two big things depressing turnout this voter cycle (the former doesn't need explanation, and many people were gonna vote for him specifically so the latter doesn't happen), and he's just not doing enough to make people want to vote for him.
This should make all of the people who insist that anyone criticising Biden is supporting Trump think again. How is he going to win if we just pretend he's awesome while nobody actually believes it?
"Trump would be worse" is not the compelling political platform you seem to think it is.
How is he going to win if we just pretend he's awesome while nobody actually believes it?
I mean, we've been trying to do that with the economy for at least two years.
No shit, but I don't think anyone has argued that Biden is an exciting candidate. His administration, other than supporting Israel (along with 90% of the rest of the US political establishment, for like the past 60 years) and some missteps on labor rights, has been competent. Considering that the next President, barring some very surprising development, WILL be either Trump or Biden, all people have been saying is that it sure doesn't help to make people who would vote against Trump or for Biden more apathetic or disillusioned. Nobody said "anyone criticising Biden is supporting Trump", because they haven't said that, in fact, those people seem to forget Trump exists at all. It's a matter of de facto supporting trump by discouraging the Democratic vote. If Biden would step aside and someone else could run, great. If not, talking shit about Biden absolutely helps Trump.
Nobody said "anyone criticising Biden is supporting Trump"
People absolutely say that on Lemmy, at least.
It's a matter of de facto supporting trump by discouraging the Democratic vote. If Biden would step aside and someone else could run, great. If not, talking shit about Biden absolutely helps Trump.
This would be a great point if it looked like Biden was going to win. But as things stand, he's behind in the polls. So we should be criticising to make him better. You know, if you actually want to stop Trump.
If Biden is the democrat candidate running against Trump, and if a person lives in a riding/region where their vote matters (e.g., not a Republican stronghold)... (and assuming the person DOESN'T want Trump to win)
- Voting for Biden supports a Democrat victory
- Voting for Trump supports a Republican victory
- Voting third party takes a vote away from Biden, thus supporting a Republican victory
- Abstaining from voting takes a vote away from Biden, thus supporting a Republican victory
So if you want the Republicans to lose, a person should vote for Biden.
I'm sorry. It's the way the US political system works, and it's the way it works where I live, too.
If you don't want Trump to win (and the rest of the other "ifs" also apply to your situation), then your only choice at the polls is to vote for Biden. Not liking your options won't change the reality of the situation.
This doesn't really address my point. I understand how first past the post works (also from a country with this system), the issue is whether Biden is going to win at all. Polls say no and maybe that should be an issue?
maybe that should be an issue?
It's not as these people are already crafting their excuses for why it'll be someone else's fault if he loses just like Trump did right before the 2020 election. Democrats want to keep the status quo of shitty politics which is why they aren't doing anything to improve the situation and why we're not allowed to criticize them. Just shut your eyes and mouth and toe the party line!
Criticizing Biden on something as niche as Lemmy won't make Biden better. But it might make people less likely to vote for Biden.
Conservatives/Republicans don't just try to win by getting votes. They also try to win by reducing the number of voters (whether by creating barriers to voting, or spreading voter apathy (especially towards the other party/parties))
Criticizing Biden on something as niche as Lemmy won't make Biden better. But it might make people less likely to vote for Biden.
Oh sorry I better fuck off to Twitter then. I know Biden isn't reading. I still have freedom of speech and can say whatever I like on Lemmy.
You can tell me I'm helping the republicans if you want, I don't care. Either it's on me for expressing my opinion or it's on Biden for sending weapons and providing political cover to a government on trial for genocide. If you want to blame me and people like me I think that says more about you than it does about us.
Is it "a thing" to bring up freedom of speech when one doesn't have a good argument? Lol
I guess it does happen pretty often.
"What you're saying is inaccurate"
But I have freedom of speech!
Lol
No it's a "thing" to bring it up if someone says "don't share your opinion," super clear from the conversation.
"What you're saying is inaccurate"
Yeah if you had said that it would have been a very stupid response
Unless you have some history idk about you're getting downvotes because some lefties think not engaging with reality will make it go away. I hate trump as much as any sane person, and understand he cannot win or the country might be lost, but Biden and the Democrats are floundering in the face of an existential threat (well, multiple existential threats) and ignoring that won't just magically turn voters blue.
Apparently Biden also wants Trump to win..
Polls are mostly just push advertising ATM.
~~I am pro-immigration, but I can’t deny that most immigrants coming to the U.S. are from conservative backgrounds and so it’s no wonder that results like the one in this poll happen.~~
Edit possibly unreliable poll, see op ed here: https://lemmy.world/post/12773276
Nothing in your link talks about conservatism.
~~You’re right, I am making assumptions about voter ages and religious backgrounds of immigrants. Younger generations are typically more left leaning, but not of voting age quite yet~~
You seem to be mapping the demographic politics of the US onto other countries.
No, I am only talking about the U.S. in this case, not other countries.
That makes absolutely no sense as you were referring to the politics of immigrants to the US.
That's a very strange thing to assume. Also, you seem to be assuming that immigrants can come to the U.S. and immediately get the right to vote.