NFL

Everyone was talking about pats being a sneaky good team until judon and Gonzalez got hurt. Ever since then everyone says pats suck. We lost our best player. And arguably our 3rd best player the same week. Is Jones the best? He'll no. But we had a sick defense until judon was injured.

Patriots never had good defenses. Certainly never won games or even Super Bowls with low scoring offensive output. They never flipped through numerous OL and receivers . Nope, it was all Brady.

That’s not the issue with Belichick. We all know and give him credit for being the mastermind behind Patriots defenses.

But the main issue is that even with all those stats you just laid out the Patriots offense was STILL BETTER!!!!!

It’s Belichick a question as to whether or not he can still coach up a defense post Brady. It’s a question on whether or not he can coach THE OFFENSE!!!!! without him!!!

As far as it’s shown for what his teams have don’t offensively without Brady you can’t by any metric give any of the credit to Belichick and that’s the issue!!!!

The argument has also been Brady is a SYSTEM QB. And that he’d be NOTHING WITHOUT HIM!!!!!! BELICHICK MADE BRADY!!!!

That’s the real revisionist history and Slander that has come from Belifans camp

It’s funny you decided to only show the defensive stats and that you also didnt compared them to post Brady at all either.

Because if you had done so you would’ve exposed that the Pats defenses have still been good without Brady. And the real thing that has OBVIOUSLY changed is the offense!!!!!!!!

Trying to paint this narrative as if Brady was leading some mid offenses that were completely carried by his defenses and that the reason Belichick hasn’t won is because the defenses fell off.

Which is FALSE!!!!!!

Saw this post earlier and specifically came back to it so I could weigh in.

The way Belichick is looked at perfectly encapsulates the modern fan.

You win as many Super Bowls as the most successful franchises in the sport, appear in about half of the Super Bowls over 2 decades, bring the Cleveland Browns back to relevancy (they were the favorite in the AFC in 95' before the team was moved), you are the defensive mastermind behind 2 Super Bowl victories as the Giants defensive coordinator, you draft AND mentor the QB everyone uses to discredit you (who you found at spot 199 in the 6th round). You ran the whole operation. Everything. For 6 Super Bowls in an era where players moved around a lot and parity should have been at an all time high. But you destroyed parity because you and an incredible QB existed. And you worked well together, at least until the end.

This man was taking 5'8" dudes, plugging them in, and making warriors out of them. First down machines. You gave Brady and him Randy Moss and they almost went 19-0!

Brady wins a Super Bowl with a very good roster and coach in Tampa, so now Belichick is a bum. Well, yeah, hard to win when you lose a Hall of Fame QB and TE (Gronk). How would Reid look without Mahomes and Kelce in KC? Or without Dawkins and TO in Philly?

All this for a bunch of nephews to act like you are some mediocre bum.

I hope BB continues to coach and the game doesn't pass him by. He has made some bad picks. But give him a QB and 2-3 years and get the hell out of the way. It looks like they may finally be bad enough to take one of the better prospects.

tldr; lots of sports fans have memories like freaking goldfishes.

Hopefully he is in decline cause I really don't want the redskins to get good.

Thank you. People get so carried away calling Belicheck a bum. People forget he has more rings than Brady. People will do anything to make Brady look even better than he needs to be.

Bill Belichick has coached one winning season since Tom Brady left the Patriots. And he coached one winning season before he had Tom Brady as his starting quarterback.

Also have to mention his tenure as a defensive coordinator with the Giants which saw him win another 2 rings

It's much easier to play great defense when you know you have an elite QB who can come back. Many times the Pats gave up a go ahead score with less than 2 min and won because they had Brady.

Look at his record without Brady. That's all you need.

He has done nothing since Brady left. Brady left, and won a super bowl in Tampa his first year. Bellicheck is a fraud.

New England always had an easy schedule in the weakest division in the NFL. Plus they had a little help in their scheduling from Rodger Goodell. It’s the reason the Chiefs always had to play them in New England. There was a million instances of games like that. Don’t get me started on the referees across the league being Stan’s of TB. The whole Patriot thing after 9-11 was some kind of symbolic thing. Ok downvote me😆

He sure as shit knows how to bend the rule book to his advantage better than any other coach in nfl history.

Nah fr man. I got downvoted to hell for sticking up for him in another thread. The switch up is insane.

Alot of people are justifying Bill the head coach. The issue is that he’s also the GM. Bill Belichick is a great head coach, arguably greatest of all time. However it was accomplished often in spite of Bill Belichick the GM. At times the patriots roster was very devoid of talent. And Brady was able to engineer successful, sometimes historic, offenses with a skeleton crew. This allowed Bill to go full steam ahead on building and focusing on his defense.

If we ask Bill Belichick to build and coach a team on both sides of the ball, I’m not sure he’d be able to do that. Thus far we have never seen it. Brady always covered the other side with above average to stellar offensive seasons.

I think there’s a couple factors that are influencing this:

1. The failures of these patriots teams are heavily on Belichick’s hands. The Matt Patricia OC era was completely unforgivable and while you can blame that on Patricia himself for the bad offense you really have to blame Bill for placing him there in the first place. As a GM, Bill has done a very poor job in almost every area. So not only do these patriots lack talent because of Bill, but the offense specially is struggling because of Bill’s complete lack of effort/incompetency in fixing it. Week to week, he’s definitely still an amazing defensive coach, and his defenses are incredibly well put together, but that’s one half of a football team.

2. The patriots have dominated for so long, that everybody roots on their downfall probably 10 times as hard as any other team. Only the cowboys (for whatever reason) get even close to as much hate as the pats get. For two decades people have been wanting to see the day where they can watch the patriots and go “Wow this guy needs to be fired!!! This team stinks!”

It isn’t easy in this league to escape from 8-8 hell without a franchise QB.

Ugh preach.

It's literally the worst place to be in the league. Never good enough for the playoffs, but never bad enough for the generational franchise altering draft pick. Just purgatory.

There is a difference between putting out a top 10 defense for some years and being the GOAT coach.

Belichick is a brilliant football mind, but not being able to get to .500 in a decade without Brady is an indictment of his abilities. It doesn’t mean he’s bad, but it’s hard to suggest he was the best ever with that record.

Is shitting on Belichick a thing now? That wild. As someone who grew up idolizing Montana and Walsh, even I begrudgingly got to the point where I freely admit they are the greatest QB and coach respectively of all time.

How do you even begin to contemplate firing the greatest coach of all time because of a down season?

People like to point at Tom's ring from Tampa as proof that it was all Brady but without Arians, Brady only went 8-9.

Brady benefited tremendously from BB’s defenses and his own longevity. He also had Randy Moss, Gronk, Alex Hernandez, Edelman, Wes Welker, a consistently impenetrable OL (b/c of underrated OL mastermind Dante Scarnecchia), and more HOF quality talent around him EVERY year. He really only became exceptional in his last decade, because he was fortunate to have over 10 full seasons of experience to lean on. The one downside to BB now, he keeps surrounding himself with garbage assistants like Joe Judge, Matt Patricia, and Bill O’Brien

We are dunking on the man who shit all over the league and our teams for years. Let us be! Good with Brady, bad without, he sucks!

But it's really fair to want Bill gone at this point. Non pats fans see this only as "one bad season" that's happening right now, but actually it's second awful season and a lot of bad stuff overall over a lot of years. BB is a bad GM in terms of drafting and signing offensive talent. And you can't just make Bill stick to coaching and give up roster building fully to someone else. Yeah, he showed flashes here and there telling everyone he's still a great coach that can win with a bad team, but it seems like he can't build a good one anymore. I mean, Mac played one season with no offensive coaches (Patricia and Judge are just a couple of shits who had some good coaching years but on defense and special teams respectively) and almost two seasons with no oline. Oh, and the best pass catcher this team has had since Gronk left was Meyers (well maybe Hunter Henry) and all the others were pure shit or Kendrick Bourne (who missed most of the last year because Patricia has beef with every player that calls him out for being a shitty coach). But Bill doesn't want to address the needs. I don't see him giving up even an inch of his power and change in his approach that clearly doesn't work if you don't have an elite QB who can overcome bad roster around him. And that's why Belichick has to go

Okay, I’ll bite. Who’s Bill Belichick?

Imo brady sux

I mean yeah no one with a functional brain was saying otherwise. Rest of this sub needs to visit a doctor

Look, if the Pats fans want to fire Coach Belichick, I would be happy for the Bears to trade Head Coaches for him if not I am sure we could pick him up off the wavers.

BB is a great coach.....he just isn't a good GM anymore. The problem with the current situation is rooted in the fact that he is either too stubborn to realize it or is so used to having total control that he is likely unwilling to accept coaching a team with anybody but himself in charge of evaluating talent and assembling the roster. It's no different than anybody that is given that much power & control in a job for as long as he has had.

The math that cannot be squared is that, strictly as a head coach, Belichick hasn't really achieved anything significant, independent of Tom Brady. And he's had a lot of years to try. Every team he's coached with any other QB has simply not done anything great.

You're not including what happened prior to Brady though. That's fine if you want to include all of the great defenses Brady had but you can't disregard Bill's head coaching career before Brady.

Yes he had two Super Bowl wins at the DC of the Giants but he was an average to awful coach before the dynasty with Brady began. You have to take that into account.

It was the greatest D Coordinator and the Greatest QB ever on the same team. Their combined Greatness lead to all those Super Bowls.

Andy Reid was transitioned out of having total control over personnel in Philadelphia?

Belichick is held to the highest of standards, so any roasting is to be expected. He has complete autocracy over the football operation too so it applies even more. Sub 500 in his career without Tom. Not looking good for him.

Oh the classic defense argument huh? Well if a top 10 defense was so incremental to winning a title, than why dont the Ravens have more Lombardi Trophies? Why did the Bears only have 1985? Honest question here?

But honestly how is any roasting of him not deserved? Genuinely curious?