So far... below wilt/bill russel/kareem/hakeem/shaq/moses
But 3 mores seasons of the past 3 years? He might end up higher than hakeem
this post was submitted on 30 Nov 2023
1 points (100.0% liked)
NBA - Main
14 readers
4 users here now
Game analysis, highlights and everything else that is happening in the NBA.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
Offense wise, he is up there with Shaq as the most dominant player to play the game. Above them is only Wilt but that's due to the era he played in. His defense is average but that's another story.
Jokic is easily the best offensive center ever, but the defensive gap is big, that's why he needs more accolades. Jokic is leagues best shooter and playmaker on those lists, legitimately not even remotely close. He's also by far the worst defender there.
Kareem, Wilt, Russell, Shaq, Hakeem are all easily above Jokic imo. I'd say Jokic is somewhere from 6-8 with Moses Malone and David Robinson. Probably 7th behind Moses imo, but i wouldn't argue if you put him one spot higher or lower.
I know “all time rank” now means some combination of ability, stats, accolades, longevity, etc. so Jokic couldn’t possibly be in that upper tier yet for people here, but If we’re talking purely about who contributes the most to winning basketball games relative to their era, I’m putting Jokic up against any of them
They’re easily above him by volume, but man if you adjust for the time Jokic has had I think he’s right with them.
I don't see him in the top 5 yet, but perhaps if he can keep this up for longer.
Shaq-Wilt-Russell-Malone and then Jokic.i think Jokic can surpass Malone.
Jokic may not be better (or the best Center). However i think Jokic is better overall basketball player than them all of the above.
Dis you forget Hakeem or is there a reason why Malone and Jokic are above him?
He forgot Kareem also
Kareem?
Shaq's defensive dominance makes him a better overall basketball player than jokic.
For jokic to crack the top 5, imo, he needs to just keep stacking titles/MVPs. I know this sub slobs all over his advanced stats but his defense is ok at best, and when you're comparing him to all time great centers, most of those guys were elite defensively AND offensively.
Jokic is just so damn unique with his ball handlign/passing/range that its hard to know where to place him.
does his overall offensive prowess offset his defensive shortcomings when compared to the all time greats? That's the real debate and why its such a fun one, because there's never been a center like that before.
He may be the better overall offensive basketball player but he isn't a better overall player than any of Shaq, Wilt, Bill, Robinson, Hakeem, Ewing, Kareem. Defense is a major factor here. The question is whether Jokic superior offense makes up for his lack of defense and against some guys it does (he's better than Ewing) and against some it doesn't.
nr 1
32nd
So I think without an entire career of excellence I think you can't reasonably put him ahead of Hakeem, Shaq, Wilt, Russell, or Kareem. To me he is either 6th or 7th, and the person he is competing with is David Robinson. Personally I think Jokic is the better basketball player peak wise. From an accomplishments standpoint he has the extra MVP, and a championship as the clear best player. So I think by the end of his career Jokic will be clearly ahead of DRob, but right now DRob has more years of elite play, so I would not fight anyone who had DRob 6.
The next person is usually Moses Malone, and I actually feel pretty strongly that Jokic is better, but i'm probably lower on Moses and higher on DRob than most people.
Really well stated. I’m personally really high on Moses strictly based on career comparisons, but Jokic will most likely turn out to be a better player than him by the time he’s done. I also think the Admiral has a strong argument, but like Malone he has his whole career layed out in front of him while Joker has a while left to go, so its hard to say right now
Jokic better than Shaq for sure.
Imagine Jokic with prime Kobe or prime D.Wade.
He even fits young LeBron.
And he definitely ain't gonna bitchin' about his partners.
Kareem
Bill
Wilt
Shaq
Hakeem
Jokic
Moses
Jokic > Shaq
He just don't have prime Kobe or prime D.Wade around.
I think it’s easy to say he’s comfortably top 10 without question for centers all time. I think he’s a bit on the outside looking in towards the Mount Rushmore of bigs which I’d say in no particular order is Wilt, Kareem, Shaq, Russell. I’d say he’s somewhere around that 5-8 realistically surrounded by Hakeem, Moses, and DRob.
Ultimately I think he can actually make it onto people’s Mount Rushmore because (in my personal opinion) I think assuming the health of him and teammate which to be fair is asking a lot, I wouldn’t be shocked in the least to see them repeat this year and ultimately position themselves for a 3-peat.
6th no bias
7th.
Dwight
Kareem
Shaq
Wilt
Russel
Hakeem
Jokic
Moses
He'd have to win another title to surpass Hakeem.
Whenever you have to explain your troll, just don't do it.
By greatness top 6/7 (top 5 centers are all in the top 10 greatest players of all time) by performance/skill imo he is the best but it's hard to compare different eras.
6th! My personal list goes as:
- Kareem
- Wilt
- Russell
- Shaq
- Hakeem
- Jokic
- Malone, M.
- Robinson
- Ewing
- Mikan
His defensive play is underrated. And this year he is much better in that aspect. But I would not look at Jokic as a Center. He is for me creator and scorer. He is an abnormality in that position. For me overall he is the better player but not the best center.
He’s better than Moses and Robinson.
The thing is Kareem, Wilt and Bill are almost myth status at this point
So that leaves 2 ahead of him in Shaq and Hakeem imo, and if Jokic keeps playing at this lvl a couple of years into his 30s, then I could see it depending on taste where you place him compared to those 2. The lvl of play is there, the duration just isn’t yet
Just need to see what he does from here on out.
It is always so interesting to see such topics (not just about Jokic, but players in general.)
Because Bron is (so oddly) one of the most criticized stars ever. You are asking about Jokic's ALL-TIME CENTER RANKING as Joker now has 2 RSMVPs, 1 FMVP, 1 title and 1 Finals appearance.
Bron has 4 RSMVPs, 4 FMVPs, 4 titles, 10 Finals appearances and casually set the all-time scoring record despite scoring never being his greatest skill.
I don’t know what these guys are smoking but Hakeem is the greatest center of all time.
Hes not top 5 center yet
I think we should only compare him to players who entered the league after NBA/ABA merger. The game has changed too much. That makes Jokix the third best center, behind Hakeem and Shaq.
Jokic is 3 blocks away per game from being the best center ever. Sadly this is what's holding him back from the top 5.
Center is the most stacked position ever. Jokic, despite being legitimately an amazing player, is at this point probably just about cracking the top 10 somewhere in like 8-10.
I mean, the top 5 in no particular order are Shaq, Wilt, Bill, Hakeem, and Kareem. Jokic is not yet close to that level. Then you have Ewing, Robinson, Moses Malone, Willis Reed, Bill Walton, Dwight, Alonzo Mourning. So that's like 12 guys.
Jokic in my opinion is better than Dwight, Mourning, Ewing. He's not yet better than Robinson or Malone but he does have a very strong shot of passing them. He's around the level of Reed and Walton (though has them beat already in terms of longevity) That puts him at around number 8 all time for me.