If you live in a society, you'll probably end up memorizing the meanings of arbitrary symbol sequences.
I'm talking, of course, about place names, people's names and ... what'cha call'em .... words.
(Disclaimer: I'm not in a shower right now.)
this post was submitted on 03 Oct 2025
54 points (87.5% liked)
Showerthoughts
39030 readers
2312 users here now
A "Showerthought" is a simple term used to describe the thoughts that pop into your head while you're doing everyday things like taking a shower, driving, or just daydreaming. The most popular seem to be lighthearted clever little truths, hidden in daily life.
Here are some examples to inspire your own showerthoughts:
- Both “200” and “160” are 2 minutes in microwave math
- When you’re a kid, you don’t realize you’re also watching your mom and dad grow up.
- More dreams have been destroyed by alarm clocks than anything else
Rules
- All posts must be showerthoughts
- The entire showerthought must be in the title
- No politics
- If your topic is in a grey area, please phrase it to emphasize the fascinating aspects, not the dramatic aspects. You can do this by avoiding overly politicized terms such as "capitalism" and "communism". If you must make comparisons, you can say something is different without saying something is better/worse.
- A good place for politics is c/politicaldiscussion
- Posts must be original/unique
- Adhere to Lemmy's Code of Conduct and the TOS
If you made it this far, showerthoughts is accepting new mods. This community is generally tame so its not a lot of work, but having a few more mods would help reports get addressed a little sooner.
Whats it like to be a mod? Reports just show up as messages in your Lemmy inbox, and if a different mod has already addressed the report, the message goes away and you never worry about it.
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
Agreed.
Still, OP is making a good point.
I sometimes try to imagine what it would be like to not be able to read. Esp. In an urban environment, as opposed to fields & forests. There's just so much everywhere, signage, ads, displays...
We sort of do, sometimes, at some point, "stop" reading.
For example, I live in a city. My stop is served by about 5 different routes, but since I'm so close to center, the remaining part of the route is basically the same for 3 out of 5 of these. Most trips go to center though, the one that does not only goes once an hour, while the rest total up to maybe 25 per hour. (One of those takes significantly longer but would still get me there.)
Initially I would read the signage, but eventually I don't think I really need to, since in 99.9% of cases I can just see a big thing arriving and hop on it. That's because I already have the context of where I am, what is the time and what kinds of trips are likely. Also, the 3 optimal routes are served by tram and 2 trolley buses, while the one "bad" route is served by a regular-sized bus and the one "sub-optimal" route is served by a long bus. So just by looking at the shape of thing is arriving (or listening to the sound it's making) I can already make a really good guess if it's ok for me.
So my (kinda weak) point is in really common situations we kind of stop needing to look at (or even stop looking at) the numbers, although we would still remember them for other reasons.
Thought experiment: take that whole situation you just described and replace all letters and numbers with meaningless alien symbols. Does it still work?
LOL next time I wait for tram I'll just imagine meaningless alien symbol arrive instead of it. :D
But really, I think the abstraction is kind of fascinating. The "closeness" of a route 34 to route 36 means nothing. Or the number of "34" in route 34 has nothing to do with gate 34 on an airport. So much is kind of obvious to most adult humans. (I think--and I suppose there might be interesting cases with neurodiversity.)
Now what if instead of numbers it was happy cartoon-like animal symbols like they use in day cares. Again, I can state the obvious: duck is a bird and hen is a bird, but the "duck route" and "hen route" don't need to have anything to do with each other. And sure, duck route and duck airport terminal have nothing to do with each other as well. Again, sort of obvious, right?
Then if it's alien symbols: sure, now I can't do the connections like "32 vs 34" or "duck vs hen" anymore, can't I? Well .. no matter meaning in any other context, as long as I can recognize difference between two symbols I can also recognize similarity between other potential pair of symbols. Eg. if two alien symbols had a dominant vertical line then I could still have the same space for connections.
My point is that this need of separating the abstraction from concretion is inevitable, regardless of whether the symbol has a conflicting meaning used elsewhere. As long as we attach some understanding to the symbols, there are still some relations we might want to attach to them. That's even if we did not use the same symbols elsewhere, which we do.
The next stage of the thought experiment: what if it's not symbols but just the real things. Can I recognize a tram from another one? (Literally one physical vehicle from another?) Well it would be really hard but actually also counter-productive in the modern world, because the whole point of the abstraction in those arbitrary numbers is that they represent the route -- which is also completely abstract concept. Ie. it does not have to be the same vehicle, and the same vehicle could be re-assigned to another route.
I don't know where on this axis would the radio frequencies mentioned in OP be placed, though. Frequencies exist in range(s) so a certain frequency currently on your radio receiver being higher or lower than the target one does tell you how to twist the knob. (Yeah, I'm 45 years old so I have used analog radio, although it was like 30 years ago...) There must be at least one other axis to it.
I didn't think that through; what I really meant: replace all numbers and letters with nothing. Even if you had years to memorize everything before that change, I don't think you'd fare well. As you seem to have pointed out in your second-to-last paragraph.
BTW the metro in Mexico City uses (Aztec, Mayan?) symbols for its routes (in addition to numbers iirc) because many people can't read. Same with many preschool games: instead of trying to teach numbers/letters/counting prematurely, they just use colors or animals instead.
And when you think that through, letters and numbers on signage aren't all that different from "take a left at that big oak". And there's nothing wrong with that. But then there's all sorts of non-essential stuff, ads, stickers on lamp posts, serial numbers...
But those numbers aren't arbitrary. There are reasons they are set, and there are reasons you would remember them.
I mean you get that even if you don't live in a city.
Wait 'til you find out about nouns.
The arbitrary fuckers can be character strings as well as numbers.
I'm not sure you understand what "arbitrary" means.
Those numbers are not random or without reason.
They are not random, but what is the rationale?
Suppose there exists a radio station, "WACD 902 AM, The Sturge". The number represents the frequency of the radio wave in megahertz. Now why did they choose that specific frequency? Did they have a specific preference for that number? Or more likely, they just chose whatever was available.
Farmers wouldn’t do it with highway and township numbers?
You're not wrong but I'm kinda with OP here: it's going to be much more in an urban or even town environment, as opposed to fields & forests.
I don't live in a city but I know all the train and bus numbers around here. Because in some countries you get public transport outside the big cities ...
Lol farmers would have to know more since they drive on countless highways.
Seed amounts? Field sizes? Water? Nutrients? Come on.
0118999...
725.... 3
Is that the express bus route to the airport?
No, to the hospital
And phone area codes.
gotta say. jesse wells was played on XRT and it was so cool man.
..except transit routes and radio station numbers aren’t arbitrary.
I wish roads would make up their mind. Some routes have names and numbers. You end up having to memorize both (if you want to give/get directions from other humans).
One three hundred thirtysix seven o seven o