There's a dozen other RPGs I could have used as well, but Pathfinder is the meme one.
My old boss at WotC said his game group played Pathfinder because it was better than D&D.
this post was submitted on 10 Oct 2026
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That's because it is 3.5 DnD, and 3.5 dnd was the best DnD.
Touch AC. various attack bonuses. Crit confirmation. Cloaks of Resistance handed out like candy at specific levels just to make the math work. Its okay haha
Are we talking the PC game or just the ruleset in general?
The ruleset, I played Rise of the Rune Lords and it (the rules) was alright. I just remember I had to bounce between a bunch of different defenses and attack bonuses and everything was a build etc and the math only worked if you got certain items and certain levels. Just was not for me. Oh and my character was frightened nearly every fight and I could hardly do shit except turtle mode and go full defense as my action. And I never confirmed my crits.
Killing monsters as the main source of xp was a 3E-ism, and honestly I dont like that it really is just a monster hunting fight game that used dungeon delving mechanics
Reading about it actually makes me think id like it better but I would have to play the variant that removes the linear stat increases so low-level enemies arent trivial.
Can you link me to these rules? Sounds interesting. I'm writing a campaign for my group, and I'd like a way to have typical bandits still be an issue throughout the game.
You might also be interested in E6 rules. With those, character don't progress beyond level 6, but continue to gain feats at a faster rate.
https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=2762
Proficiency without Level
This variant removes a character's level from their proficiency bonus, scaling it differently for a style of game that's outside the norm. This is a significant change to the system. The proficiency rank progression in Player Core is designed for heroic fantasy games where heroes rise from humble origins to world-shattering strength. For some games, this narrative arc doesn't fit. Such games are about hedging bets in an uncertain and gritty world, in which even the world's best fighter can't guarantee a win against a large group of moderately skilled brigands.
Thank you!
If you're running high fantasy, try it RAW. It actually feels pretty natural in setting.
If you're playing low fantasy, then yeah proficiency without level works, but i'd probably also really limit access to magic and slow down level progression.
I don't understand how everyone doesn't just invent or cobble together their own system. It's so fun! And with cool players, you can build up the rules over time.
You might have to befriend some drama nerds. I used to think tabletop games sucked but it's because I was playing with [unimaginative] engineering types.
100% this. I usually dm for drama types, currently running a game with engineering types. It's a completely different game.
But I'll leaning into it, I created an absurdly complicated ship management system and they're digging it.
Love the ones you're with. <3
This 100%.
Used to play a drinkingish game where someone would just randomly start by saying "so who are you?" And you'd come up with some insane thing; a divorced dad, a bucket with sentience, god, and the confused new person would always say themselves. Ask what they're good at and you have a character.
I'm a dog wearing two left shoes, I'm good at sniffing, dancing and people like me.
Then just grab a coin and use it to decide the fate of things. It's last like 15-20 mins tops before it got ridiculous and you'd just kill everyone off and laugh. Maybe if you're fancy you'd ask for someone to chug their drink as a CON save or death save or something. My dog is good at fighting because people like him and he's good at dancing. My dog can find the invisible monster cause of his sniffing skills.
It's literally that easy. I've done this game in the car with kids too they love it. If you find a license plate with your initials or birthday on it or something you get a free success or something.
Rules are there so everyone knows what we're doing. That's all they needed for. We're just playing pretend gang.
Come to Lancer! We have crunchy combat and are anti fascist!
I love Lancer, but I have real issues with the lack of balance passes (because printing errata would apparently be unfair for hardcopy players).
Play anything that isn't WotC.
Loved Pathfinder when it came out, currently into Draw Steel.
I mean, Pathfinder is literally D&D with a few changes.
Specifically, it’s DND 3.5e with some changes.
So, you have the best full version of DND (3.0) with all the changes made to make the system function the way it was intended and be much more balanced (3.5), with another total revision to balance, the introduction of many new mechanics, over a decade of new content, and an active publisher who makes massive use of the OGL (PF 1.0).
That's Pathfinder 1e though. Pathfinder 2e is even better in my opinion because it takes what was good from 1e (the world, the customization options, ...) and simplifies play enormously for both the GM and the players to be much more beginner friendly.
I never played DnD 4e but afaik, some of the greatest changes of PF2e have been in DND 4e before and didn't make it to DnD 5e.
PF2.0 isn’t for me or my tables, with a few exceptions. We want the crunch. I really appreciate what Paizo did with 2.0, but it’s not a game for me.
Same. We love the nerdy minutia, leading to inevitable rules lawyering. Keeps the game fresh and surprising
D&D 3.75e
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Less so in 2e, but yeah.
God I love 2e, I know it isn't as popular as 1e for the hardcore crowd but for actually giving new people who only know DnD something with more substance and interesting character building choice, it is absolutely awesome. I'm also not a big fan of everything stacking like crazy in 1e so there is that.
I'm a PF2e fan who came from PF1e (we do exist!), and one of my favorite parts is that there aren't really any unviable build options, from either a player side or a GM side. Sure, there are combinations that are more optimal than others, but a player's going to be able to have fun and contribute meaningfully with just about any ancestry/class combination. And since the encounter math actually works, pretty much any mathematically-correct combination of monsters a GM throws at a party will probably present the desired challenge.
So, yes! Agreed.
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Symbaroum, not the D&D version, is awesome.
Pathfinder is the sooo good. So much customization!
One time I made spider man. But he could only web swing thrice per day, was weaker than every enemy, and kind of just died randomly due to lack of spidey sense. But he had a wicked 6 paragraph alter-ego mechanic that the goblins appreciated
Step 1: Pathfinder Step 2: Savage Pathfinder Step 3: Other Savage Worlds games Step 4: Become a proper TTRPG nerd
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I’m glad my friend got me into D&D. Definitely daunting at first, but once you start to realize no one is the main character and you can focus on your own story as an individual, the ability to play how you want starts to open up. It’s all about committing to the bit.
That and it takes time. Lots and lots of time.
As a player, I can certainly say that the choices my character makes are not the ones I would.
My character spent an entire session running towards the fight where he knew that there were like fifty people fighting the rest of our team. He was looking for the first opportunity to let loose a fireball to assist his teammates.
I, the player, knew that the team was surviving pretty ok and didn't need me to cast anything. I, the player, knew that up casting fireball at forth level was a terrible idea. I, the player, knew there was only one enemy left with 3hp.
My character on the other hand did 32 damage to this lone zombie and alerted the other 150 enemies further away down the battlefield to our presence.
Now, we had to scramble to come up with a way to get an 8h long rest to heal and get spell slots back even though the army was less than 2 hours away and coming towards us.
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