I remember watching DS9 back in the 90s. I didn't see it as a bad show. Not sure why people hate it. But then again... I haven't seen any of it since the 90s...
this post was submitted on 19 Nov 2024
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DS9 was probably the most interesting of the shows of that time though. It broke several of Roddenberry’s rules:
- plenty of characters had long-running interpersonal gripes and grievances. In TNG everything was returned to status quo after any given episode or two parter. No one really argued with each other, everyone just learned a life lesson and everything was back to normal the next episode. Voyager started with some tension on the ship between the Maquis and the federation crew but that basically stopped after like 5 episodes and it was back to TNG camaraderie.
- it wasn’t on a ship that went travelled about.
- it had long running storylines that lasted several seasons. TNG had a few two parters and that season 1 conspiracy thread with the creepy crawlies taking over the federation but not much beyond that. Voyager had Species 8472 and the Borg and Kazon and whatnot but it was pretty straight adventure of the week stuff most of the time.
- it showed the federation being less than perfect. The federation of DS9 was flawed and made poor decisions at times. Sisko did something so bad once that they dedicated a whole episode to a log entry where he convinces himself he can live with the amoral decision he made to protect the federation, and Section 31 was a whole unit purpose made for dirty work.
- it had Garak. Dude would just straight up murder people, and he was one of the good guys.
- they played baseball. Not blurgball or space-baseball, just straight baseball. It was a shit show of a game, mind you, but they didn’t invent some futuristic sport just because they had to. They just did a baseball.
I think DS9 is the most interesting Trek series of them all.
should i start on ds9 or is that a terrible idea
Yes. Start with TNG, it establishes that era of Trek. DS9 is very much a spin-off.
I watched it this year for the first time. Got a bit slow at points but I enjoyed it.
For context I much preferred Babylon 5 back in the day as it had big story arcs.
It’s difficult for me to answer in an unbiased way because I grew up watching the shows during their original run and I generally watch one or two of the series runs each year. I watched TOS earlier this year and am presently part way through VOY. Did TNG last Christmas, might do DS9 this Christmas. I’ve got history with these here shows.
It might be better to watch TNG first to see what Roddenberry was going for and see how he set the Star Trek “rules” so to speak before you see how they were broken in DS9 as that might have more impact. TNG might seem a little quaint after watching DS9.
As for Voyager… VOY is effectively an alt-TNG and not really distinguishable but also not offensive if you throw out the space salamanders and similarly horrid episodes. VOY started with the premise of being a series about a ship on its own trying to get home and having to deal with limited resources and always scrambling for fuel and water or whatever, but that sense of desperation lasted about 3 episodes before it reverted to TNG Part 2. It could have really been something but they didn’t have the guts to push any boundaries. Battlestar Galactica 2004 feels like that concept done correctly before it kind of went off the rails when they forgot what show they started with, but I digress.
I think you’d appreciate DS9 more by letting TNG set the stage. DS9 also primarily occurs chronologically after TNG for the most part, with some overlap in the early seasons, although that barely makes a difference in the narrative. Watch TNG for the vision, watch DS9 for the vision rearranged, and bear in mind that these are 30 year old shows before CGI was common place. There will be some racism and sexism in the early TNG episodes and the VFX will be spotty, but these are classics for a reason.
I'll die on the hill that ds9 wasn't bad. It wasn't the best, lowest of the 4.. but if ds9 was the worst and it's still good than the other shows are great
Um, DS9 is the best one of the 90s. Voyager is easily the worst.
I liked them the same, but I could name more episodes that I enjoyed and Voyager than DS9
lowest of the 4
by "the 4" do you mean TOS through VOY, or TNG though ENT? 🤔
I agree. But in general ranking TV series or episodes or characters or arguing that one of them was the best or worst never seems worthwhile to me.
I'm just about to finish watching season four .... and I've suddenly realized how terrible it will feel when I get to the end. Man I love this show!
You've hit the sweet spot. Season 5 is by far my favorite. A few dry spots, but solid overall.
Great times!
Introducing my daughter to Trek this year, just wrapped up S4 of DS9 a few weeks ago and S3 of Voyager the week after.
We have a few more months of golden age Trek... soaking it in.
At least I only have to worry about seeing Wesley for only one episode.
EDIT: Actually I dont have to worry about him at all, because I was hallucinating one episode ans replacing Nog with Wesley for some reason.
Wesley isn’t in DS9.
Turns out I have been hallucinating when Nog is listening to Vince Fontaine and sharing a room with Jake.
This whole time I remembered that as a Wesley episode.
I mean, canonically, isn't Wesley basically a Q at this point, doesn't he have Phenomenal Cosmic Powers™? Wesley disguising himself as Nog shouldn't be too hard to do. Hell, it was in a holosuite, and if anyone can rig one of those, it's Wesley.
So, what I'm saying is...canonically, there is no reason that it couldn't have been Wesley hanging out with Jake...
Wow. And Paper Moon is legitimately one of my favorite episodes that doesn't get a lot of fanfare. Replacing Nog for Wesley mentally is something I can not conceive of in that.
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I still refuse to believe Starfleet's go-to drink is caffeine-free.
Root beer was just an example of what hoomans like that seems bizarre to other species. If we're talking DS9 I'd say the go-to drink was all the caffeinated raktajino everyone was pounding
What about my comment implied I didn't realize that? Anyways, Raktajino was also consumed a lot on Voyager. Its strange that Quark focused on Root Beer in light of all the other stuff people drink, other than, hey, this is the only carbonated thing they drink that's not caffinated or alcoholic ... but that wouldn't be true either?
He did say "Starfleet" drink a lot of it, not "humans", so maybe it is just that pupular with Vulcans, Andorians, Tellerites, etc.
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Weird, I had the opposite experience. I tried to watch DS9 recently and found it so dumb by about the middle of season four I gave up.
There is a lot of dumb stuff, but also a bit very cool space pew pew, very charismatic actors and occasionally Odo emerging from a wall panel, being one step ahead of everyone.
Also, the versatile actors playing different characters are awesome, if you know about it. Oh and the mirror universe.
Mark Alaimo doesn't get enough credit for being a solid anchor for the series.
Dude has chops.
I love all the day players that are the villain/vicitms of the week. It's kind of hilarious to see the same actors again and again, but also a lot of them were also on Babylon 5.
The characters are mid and despite there being six seasons there are only four episodes:
- Odo solves a problem by changing shape
- Propaganda for the Bayjor religion
- A beloved crossover character saves the day
- Something unimaginably horrific happens to the O'Briens
You can simplify every series that way...
Agatha Christie wrote one novel over and over!
Chefs make the same three dishes over and over.
4 chord songs!!!
Life gets really monotonous if you're pessimistic enough.
Why is that PNG file 1.3 MB? Is it huge or just unoptimized? Is someone using it as a fullsize Quark poster or something?
PNG is lossless and its compression not well suited for photos. It doesn't even have to be huge to get a photo PNG of that size.
It's not TIFF. This isn't NASA imagery. PNGs do alright on compression for photos.
(at least I hope NASA hasn't captured images of Quark)
TIFF is also such a hot mess when it comes to picking the correct subformat because there are so many options for compression available, some of them FOSS, some of them proprietary. Edit: … and most of them quite dated.
PNG can zip but it's lossless, joh can lose data, and the difference is very significant
Can be lossless
How would you make a lossy PNG? Just introduce errors randomly? That makes no sense.
By reading google or the wiki
Process data so DEFLATE works more efficiently
Are we still talking about PNG? Nowhere in the PNG standard is a description of changing the actual content of an image to make it compress better with DEFLATE. If you are thinking about the filter stage you should know that in this context an image filter is just creating a different representation of the same image, because it is fully reversible.
Sounds very pedantic. ive already given the only answer im gonna give, if you want to label it something different that's your business.
Nice find. That one tells me 1401x1705 and 0.86 MB.
Quark is wise
Does anybody srsly not take it for granted that when Bonespurs says anything it just means he thought of saying it right then?
Are you having a stroke?
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