this post was submitted on 25 Jun 2025
667 points (98.7% liked)

Technology

71922 readers
4473 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related news or articles.
  3. Be excellent to each other!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, this includes using AI responses and summaries. To ask if your bot can be added please contact a mod.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
  10. Accounts 7 days and younger will have their posts automatically removed.

Approved Bots


founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

The revived No JS Club celebrates websites that don't use Javascript, the powerful but sometimes overused code that's been bloating the web and crashing tabs since 1995. The No CSS Club goes a step further and forbids even a scrap of styling beyond the browser defaults. And there is even the No HTML Club, where you're not even allowed to use HTML. Plain text websites!

The modern web is the pure incarnation of evil. When Satan has a 1v1 with his manager, he confers with the modern web. If Satan is Sauron, then the modern web is Melkor [1]. Every horror that you can imagine is because of the modern web. Modern web is not an existential risk (X-risk), but is an astronomic suffering risk (S-risk) [2]. It is the duty of each and every man, woman, and child to revolt against it. If you're not working on returning civilization to ooga-booga, you're a bad person.

A compromise with the clubs is called for. A hypertext brutalism that uses the raw materials of the web to functional, honest ends while allowing web technologies to support clarity, legibility and accessibility. Compare this notion to the web brutalism of recent times, which started off in similar vein but soon became a self-subverting aesthetic: sites using 2.4MB frameworks to add text-shadow: 40px 40px 0px hotpink to 400kb Helvetica webfonts that were already on your computer.

I also like the idea of implementing "hypotext" as an inversion of hypertext. This would somehow avoid the failure modes of extending the structure of text by failing in other ways that are more fun. But I'm in two minds about whether that would be just a toy (e.g. references banished to metadata, i.e. footnotes are the hypertext) or something more conceptual that uses references to collapse the structure of text rather than extend it (e.g. links are includes and going near them spaghettifies your brain). The term is already in use in a structuralist sense, which is to say there are 2 million words of French I have to read first if I want to get away with any of this.

Republished Under Creative Commons Terms. Boing Boing Original Article.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] anachrohack@lemmy.world 2 points 22 minutes ago

Oh neat! I'm working on a forum that doesn't use any javascript

[–] LovableSidekick@lemmy.world 8 points 2 hours ago

I'll say one thing for the No CSS philosophy - at least it eliminates light-colored text on a light-colored background using the thinnest possible font, which is probably the stupidest stylistic trend since the web began.

[–] the_q@lemmy.zip 18 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Get this bs outta here. I write on paper! No one knows my thoughts or feelings!!

[–] stormeuh@lemmy.world 9 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

What devilry is this? Written word? Real cultures use oral history to store knowledge!

[–] jsomae@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Passing information between two simultaneously existing entities? Get outta here! All cultures use the Jung collective unconscious to store knowledge!

[–] impshum@lemmy.world 1 points 42 minutes ago

WORDS???? The cheek of it!

[–] moseschrute@lemmy.ml 11 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

Just out of curiosity what percentage of people here are using Voyager as their Lemmy client?

Spoiler

Voyager wouldn’t work without JavaScript… shhh don’t tell anyone

[–] frezik@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 5 hours ago (2 children)

Maybe we could have No-JS and No-Client-Storage (which would include cookies) headers added to HTTP. Browsers could potentially display an icon showing this to users on the address bar.

Theoretically, browsers could even stop from the JS engine from being started for the site in the first place. Though I wouldn't be surprised if the engine is too tied into the code of modern browsers for that to work.

[–] sylver_dragon@lemmy.world 4 points 3 hours ago

Theoretically, browsers could even stop from the JS engine from being started for the site in the first place.

The NoScript extension is basically this. Most of the client side stuff is off by default and you can enable it per-domain. It breaks a whole lot of websites, but often in ways where the main content of a website is still readable. Over time, you can build up a list of "allow by default" domains and most of the web you care about works. Though, you may have to spend a moment or two sorting out permissions when you visit a new site.

[–] snowfalldreamland@lemmy.ml 2 points 4 hours ago

A Content-Security-Policy with script-src 'none' should already allow for that . no js can be loaded like that

[–] Matriks404@lemmy.world 31 points 11 hours ago (4 children)

What we need is a subset of modern web, without any bloat, especially JS frameworks.

A lot of websites can be static HTML + CSS.

[–] elbarto777@lemmy.world 8 points 7 hours ago

The subset exists. What you're referring to is an agreement or convention.

[–] Tillman@lemmy.world 4 points 7 hours ago

We have that, it’s called Gemini and is accessible with Lagrange

[–] fuzzzerd@programming.dev 5 points 8 hours ago

Some of these are extreme, but what you're talking about is the https://512kb.club/, just keep it small, but no limits on what you can use.

[–] Vinstaal0@feddit.nl 6 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

A lot of websites can be static HTML + CSS.

Yeah they can, I can understand you might want to use something like php to not need to edit the footers and headers every page if you ever change them, but still.

I also like how some websites like Amazon.com refuse to add a payment platform which is more than a credit card checkout. Especially because their EU sites do have payment platforms with more options to pay. So then you have an over complicated site already with a lot of bloat and some amount of your consumers can't even pay.

[–] absentbird@lemm.ee 4 points 5 hours ago

Then use a site generator like Hugo or Jekyll to stamp out new versions of your site with matching header/footer/etc.

[–] bathing_in_bismuth@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

I rather have these people embrace gopher

[–] frezik@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 5 hours ago

Let's not. It's a terrible protocol with amateur design errors.

load more comments
view more: next ›