this post was submitted on 28 Nov 2023
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Top 25 Players Under 25 As of 11/28, According to EPM (alien.top)
submitted 11 months ago by Sc0rch1ngDr4g0n@alien.top to c/nba@nba.space
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*25 year olds missing the age cutoff include SGA (+7.6), Jayson Tatum (+4.9), Trae Young (+4.4), De’Aaron Fox (+3.7), Desmond Bane (+2.6), Mitchell Robinson (+1.6), Jarrett Allen (+1.4), Michael Porter Jr. (+1.2), etc.

25 Best Players Under 25, Ordered by Net EPM (Off/Def)

  1. Tyrese Haliburton (IND): +6.4 (+8.8/-2.4)

  2. Chet Holmgren (OKC): +6.3 (+2.8/+3.4)

  3. Scottie Barnes (TOR): +4.9 (+1.7/+3.1)

  4. Anthony Edwards (MIN): +4.4 (+3.3/+1.1)

  5. Luka Doncic (DAL): +4.4 (+6.1/-1.8)

  6. Tyrese Maxey (PHI): +3.9 (+5.1/-1.2)

  7. Alperen Sengun (HOU): +3.9 (+2.8/+1.0)

  8. Jalen Suggs (ORL): +3.3 (-0.5/+3.8)

  9. Goga Bitadze (ORL): +3.2 (+0.3/+2.8)

  10. LaMelo Ball (CHA): +2.9 (+4.1/-1.2)

  11. Evan Mobley (CLE): +2.3 (-0.2/+2.5)

  12. Lonnie Walker IV (BKN): +2.1 (+2.2/-0.2)

  13. Mark Williams (CHA): +1.9 (+2.6/-0.7)

  14. Nic Claxton (BKN): +1.8 (+0.7/+1.1)

  15. Jaden Mcdaniels (MIN): +1.4 (-0.4/+1.8)

  16. Franz Wagner (ORL): +1.4 (+0.0/+1.4)

  17. Devin Vassell (SAS): +1.4 (+1.3/+0.1)

  18. Jalen Smith (IND): +1.3 (+2.0/-0.6)

  19. Zion Williamson (NOP): +1.3 (+1.6/-0.2)

  20. RJ Barrett (NYK): +1.3 (+0.9/+0.4)

  21. Isaiah Joe (OKC): +1.2 (+1.1/+0.1)

  22. Tyler Herro (MIA): +1.2 (+1.4/-0.2)

  23. Jalen Williams (OKC): +1.0 (-0.1/+1.0)

  24. Darius Garland (CLE): +0.8 (+0.5/+0.3)

  25. Jalen Johnson (ATL) : +0.8 (+0.2/+0.6)

Jalen Duren, Cam Thomas, Keegan Murray, Paolo Banchero, Victor Wembanyama, and so on followed after.

Source: https://dunksandthrees.com/epm

This is based on current production so far this season. What are some surprises on this list (or t those that didn’t make it)? What are some players in slumps/hot streaks that will go up/down or go in/out of this list?

top 25 comments
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[–] Mundingburrasaurus@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

So goga is just a better player than WCJ...wild they are going to put him back in the dog house when WCJ comes back.

[–] axnjxn00@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

He's not better, but he's a true center

[–] DNP__Rest@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Nah he's not better lol

[–] HistoricAnomaly@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Garland is very low

[–] JMoon33@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Because it's based on this season only and Garland hasn't been as good so far this season.

19/3/6 with 4 turnovers per game compare to 22/3/8 with 3 turnovers per game last season.

[–] wjbc@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

Chet Holmgren (+6.3) is the best rookie I can remember in ages. And he's still only 21. And OKC also has Isaiah Joe (+1.2) and Jalen Williams (+1). Plus SGA (+7.6) just missed the cut.

And OKC has stockpiled a huge hoard of draft picks. They literally don't have enough roster spots for all those picks even if they had just started a rebuild -- but right now they are already a playoff team on the rise. What are they going to do with all those picks?

Orlando's Goga Bitadze was not on my radar despite four full seasons in the NBA, but at age 24 he seems to have made a leap and demands attention. Apparently he's been filling in for an injured Wendell Carter, Jr., and the Magic haven't missed a beat. TIL.

[–] blacknotblack@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (2 children)

cuz he isn’t really a rookie? same as ben and blake.

[–] Round-Revolution-399@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

He’s not A rookie. He’s THE rookie

[–] Scelidotheriidae@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

You are right, he isn’t a real rookie and is massively advantaged over rookie, but you don’t need to be so defensive about it

[–] Uncle_Freddy@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I’d thought that this debate was settled during the Simmons-Mitchell race, but I guess not. They are rookies; get over it. 

[–] syllabic@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

looks like the majority of their first rounders are in the next 2 years as well so they will have to make decisions relatively soon on what to do with them

[–] LeBremsstrahlung@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Luka's the most overrated player in the NBA according to that other thread.

[–] Choice-Meeting1143@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

We should change Under 25 to 26 or under.

Just to included Tatum, Booker, and SGA. Ngl. Hhhaha.

[–] chuckchukgoose@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Tatum is already first on this list

[–] Ritchie_Blackmore@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

TIL Bitadze is 24

[–] SpeclorTheGreat@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (3 children)

I think people don’t pay enough attention to how bad Hali is defensively. He’s a huge reason why the Pacers defense sucks, and he doesn’t have much of an excuse as he’s not exactly a short guard at 6’6”.

[–] Knight725@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

trae young 2.0

[–] HoopsMcCann750@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

It basically always gets brought up.

He’s too slow to guard point guards and not strong enough to guard wings. He seriously sucks at on-ball defense and I’m not going to try to blame all of it on the rest of the team, but in an ideal future, he will be surrounded by better defenders and not in a scheme that switches at the smallest semblance of contact. I have more hope that he can be hidden on defense than I do for some of the popular comps he gets (Nash, Trae) just because there’s a solid chance he can eventually be hidden on the worst perimeter player on the court instead of being forced to guard at the point of attack.

[–] StudentMed@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

He weighs 185 lbs. Has that thin body type that gets pushed around too easily like a Trae Young, Dlo, Allen Iverson or Jalen Green.

[–] myfatbasketballs@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Just looking at this list reminds me of how good a place the nba is with talent right now.

Conversely, the nfl product gets worse every single year.

[–] Matt_Netherlands@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Banchero is the best player on the Magic. Advanced metrics are dumb when they can’t properly evaluate talent. Lol. It’s a wonder they’re 12-5 when their talent level clearly sucks according to this.

[–] RonnocFjord@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Did you not notice it ranking Goga Bitadze as the 9th best player under 25? LMAO and I’m a Magic fan

[–] MyNewAccountIGuess11@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

One day you will all see, Brandon Miller is the absolute truth

[–] Fordraxel@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

Ant clears and he's below Scottie?!?

[–] RonnocFjord@alien.top 1 points 11 months ago

I’ve always know Goga was better than Franz, Evan Mobley, and Lamelo Ball. Everyone knows he’s better than Zion, that’s a given.